>prove me wrong
What is this vierkanal /b/ back in like 2008?
You're not really putting any salient point forth with which to argue because you haven't given any hint what precisely you find wrong it. >if you hate EU so much why do you keep using their proxy? Checkmate non-unionists
I am also of conflicted opinion as someone not part of it. On one hand I am sincerely convinced that EU itself is part of a global Satanic plot to install a fascist world dictatorship governing through each continental union each of which in turn manages its national provinces. I believe this conspiracy to be a horrible form of cyberpunk neo-Capitalist and fascist dystopia, which is clearly the direction in which we've been heading (I to this day have no fucking clue why anyone believes controlled opposition shills like Alex Jones who claim that it's "Socialist" except I suspect most of these people are way too stupid to understand everything they hate has nothing to do with Socialism and everything to do with the inevitable conclusion of modern transnational Capitalism, including the fact it's captured markets run by oligopolies pretending to be "free markets" but that's a different discussion). As such, I fully oppose the EU due in part to my likely peculiarly American paranoias rooted in fatistani fixations on religious fanaticism, tyranny/liberty, and so on.
But then on the other hand you've actually got the fact that EU itself is and always has been Europe's best hope for surviving and remaining both free and independent as well as a relevant global power bloc, because let's be honest here as it stands now the entirety of Europe has been nothing but a plaything for foreign powers for three quarters a century now. I am sorry but those are just the cold hard facts of the matter. None of you guys have ever actually been completely world relevant or actual big players since the close of WWII. Ever since the first world war fractured all your guys' empires and then further destroyed yourselves yet again a couple decades later all actual power of the European states has been lost.
It fascinates me how much Europeans think they actually matter to the world to this day. You guys often act as if the entire last century of history never even happened, and Britain is by far the worst offender in that regard. Hate to break it to you but all you guys lost your empires fully a century ago. You began losing your colonies and global clout ever since the spectacular clusterfuck that was WWI fractured and destroyed many of the European nation states/empires, and thanks to a certain country burning your continent to the ground yet again you not only lost every single last one of your colonies and dissolved any semblance of being an imperial or colonial power, but even more glaringly, you have essentially been occupied since then.
What most of you seem not to understand is your are quite simply not world relevant anymore beyond what the major powers of the world see and use you as, which for a long time has been USA and Russia, and quite soon it's also going to include China. Once the soft power shield of the US falls you're all going to be in for a very rude awakening as a much less ambivalent power takes hold in the vacuum and there is no state in all of Europe that has any hope to resist them. Not a single one of you even has a strong and effective standing army. The Germans have a military, as do the Brits and maybe even the French to a degree, but no one in Europe has the sole military capacity to defend their own interests, and in fact the only thing keeping any of you afloat militarily is the French and British nuclear deterrence, which need I remind you none of you guys will have if both France and Britain leave the EU.
You also don't have as strong economies as you seem to think you do, and while perhaps Germany could stay afloat and fight for it's own economic interests itself doesn't even have the clout and economic might without a massive trade bloc.
Mark my words the only person here who isnt a complete buffoon is Sweden because he seems to understand these things very well. You have all been occupied for a long time now. You still have our not so imposing US military bases and US military presence. You had decades of terrorism and intrigue because your other occupying power was busy playing games with this one, often at your own expense. What do you think is going to happen when China finds new leadership and finally starts getting pushy? They will respect you and your sovereignty and concerns even less. They will be unscrupulous business partners and will do everything they can to wreck your economies and make you their own captured market who sees Europe as nothing more than a Disneyworld with few interesting trinkets to loot from your museums if it strikes their fancy. Close to half of you already had to put up with this after living under Russian rule, and the moment the EU fully fractures you'll get to deal with the Russians yet again. Just imagine being fully at their mercy to do whatever they want or they'll cut off your heating and electricity in the winter because they got butthurt at you for some reason. Just imagine not having any coordinated European or American/NATO defense efforts when Russia finally decides to stop penetrating your airspace and crusing around in your territorial waters with nuclear capable subs and warships.
Better yet go and ask Ukraine what it's like dealing with the Russians when they think you are weak and no one else will come and help you. Or go and ask Georgia about that.
Do not misinterpret this as fatposting; I already told you part of the cost of being a US plaything. Your culture is now American. Your industries are mostly all at the mercy of American financial interests. Some of you live in countries where they don't even see their own language as relevant anymore and speak English with each other in their own countries.
All of these things happened precisely because you didnt have EU. You are only just barely being saved from further irrelevance and humiliation by the fact USA is largely soft power and doesnt seem to have the same ambitions or capacity to inflict violence on you as others and that's only because we already did--repeatedly--and fully absorbed you into our sphere of influence to the point of being borderline vassal states at times.