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No. 24384
56 kB, 600 × 600
With the news of billionaire pedophile Jeffrey Epstein’s arrest and the probable implication of many other rich and powerful Americans, I’m reminded of why I’ve always found the decades of these rumors completely believable—the “Dutroux incident” in Belgium.
Marc Dutroux is a career criminal, multiple murderer, and serial rapist/pedophile who was convicted of abducting and sexually assaulting several young girls in the 1980s, but was released after only 3 years in prison.
He went on to reoffend almost immediately, keeping captured teenagers in his basement until they starved to death and even killing one of his own business associates.
The notable aspects of this case that make it unusual in comparison to the average serial-killer-type tale are Dutroux’s high-level connections to the upper tiers of Belgian society and the notable “incompetence” involved with the investigation.
For example, at one point, police actually inspected Dutroux’s home, HEARD the screaming of the starving young women in his basement, and appeared to decide they had simply “come from elsewhere.”
They also seized videotapes that depicted Dutroux building the cell in his basement, but never even viewed the tapes, and then RETURNED them.
It is certain that children died due to this unforgivable police work, but it’s also quite likely that this was something more sinister than mere incompetence.
Dutroux, it transpired during trial, was involved with pedophile/trafficking rings which implicated vast swathes of the Belgian govt., police, and civil service.
Once actual victims of said rings began coming out and offering to testify to support Dutroux’s claim of a much vaster criminal conspiracy, the investigation seemed to be hamstrung at every turn. Key evidence was “lost,” over TWENTY witnesses or potential witnesses died under unclear or mysterious circumstances, and the well-liked, crusading judge in charge of investigation was abruptly fired for conflict of interest on the grounds that he had attended a fundraising dinner for the families of the murdered girls.
His replacement dismissed much evidence as irrelevant or incorrect, and in fact a counterinvestigation was even launched against the original judge, who eventually testified that he was forced to travel under armed guard and that contracts had been taken out on his head.
The victims, too, were subjected to a relentless campaign of smears, threats, psychological pressure, and dismissals—such that nearly all of them, even when supposedly protected by anonymity, withdrew their testimony.
In the end Regina Louf was one of the few victims of the ring who did not withdraw her testimony. Instead, the police dismissed it.
Dutroux’s co-defendant, Michel Nihoul, was a high-profile businessman whose involvement in these “sex parties”—widely alleged to include torture and even murder of young children—seemed to have been an open secret.
Dutroux claimed to have kidnapped young girls “to order” for Nihoul—who, as a mover and shaker in Belgian society, was acquitted of conspiracy and trafficking charges, and only served a small sentence for selling drugs. He is a free man today.
In an interesting coincidence, during this same time period, Belgium also saw the rise of the Brabant Killers, a bizarre gang of thugs who committed mass shootings and armed robberies throughout the 1980s, resulting in the death of nearly 30 people. Much evidence points to this gang having heavy links with (indeed, if not being COMPOSED of) the Belgian gendarmerie, some of whom themselves (such as openly fascist policeman Madani Bouhouche) were members of neo-Nazi organizations and linked with Belgium’s version of Operation GLADIO. Throughout his trial, which began 8 years after his first arrest and ended in a sentence of life imprisonment, Dutroux continued to insist on the existence of the pedophile ring and its penetration into the highest levels of Belgian politics, civil service.
>>
No. 24385
that case will never be fully revealed. so many persons linked to it died under highly questionable circumstances, yet it seems that authorities don't care about those cases nor about the main case itself. it reeks of highly organized crime within the highest ranks of authorities and there's probably nobody who could testify left or those who could testify don't want to out of fear or other reasons.
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No. 24416
All that comes to my mind when I read about such cases is that they are consequences of the fact that power corrupts people / individuals (and absolute power corrupts absolutely).
>>
No. 24423
>>24416
Except I am pretty sure molesting little girls ain't normal. Well, in Epsteins case I think a lot of them were like 15 so at least they were kids not literal children but still.

I think what it is is that the complete lack of moral responsibility allows those people to act out their worst impulses, and that it says a lot about you for what those worst impulses are. Like I personally wouldnt even consider getting handjobs from 15 year olds and I'm massively younger than Epstein which just makes it creepier. In the DuTroux case they were 11 year olds which is even more fucked up. Also the way Epstein did it was incredibly slimy and disgusting. During the 2016 campaign I remember it being brought up like all he was doing was paying 15 year olds hundreds of dollars to give naked massages. Of course what he was actually doing was getting runaways and kids from problem homes, preying on the most vulnerable of the most vulnerable, who he could have had murdered and society wouldnt notice or care, and also raped at least one kid. I am positive that Donald Trump also raped a 15 year old who told him no she wasnt going to do sex and then threatened to murder her and her family if she told anyone. People like Epstein, Bill Clinton, and Donald Trump are just those kinds of sleazy people.

As for me, I know I'd mainly be interested in massive blackmail networks and possibly assassinations if I wasnt accountable to anyone not even God. Sex is irrelevant to me, so, I probably have even more of a problem with this. Although I guess having a certain hated rival adult 40-60 year old man molested or possibly brutally raped if he was doing this stuff would also be satisfying, purely out of power and degradation instead of a sexual thing. Like Epstein for instance. Or just having people like that murdered.

So again, it speaks more to the type of person you are and your worst excesses, which in the case of the rich and powerful is just fully realized. Like you can be an absolute hedonist without being a rock star. There are child molesters who are not rich and powerful. Wealth and power just remove the personal and societal brakes. The probably also encourage a lot of the worst behavior with the means one must go to in order to protect those massive concentrations of wealth and power from others, which I guess could theoretically be argued that's what Epstein and the DuTroux network were doing.
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No. 24432
>>24416
A sinner is a saint who had opportunity. We might not all be messed up in the exact same way but we're still kingdom animalia. Society just hides the savage deep down. Give someone enough opportunity to be an animal and they'll find a motive all on their own. We're clever beasts, but beasts all the same.
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No. 24434
68 kB, 750 × 375
Ok guys I don’t want to seem like a nutcase but it appears Epstein literally has a temple to the occult on his pedo island:

The federal charges against Jeffrey Epstein, unsealed on Monday morning in New York City, open the latest chapter in the very public campaign to bring the financier to justice. They also underscore how little is known about his life, including the source of his wealth, and how what is known doesn't quite add up. For instance: Is that really a temple on his private island? And to what?

Epstein's island, officially known as Little Saint James, is situated between St. Thomas and St. John, two of the largest islands of the US Virgin Islands in the Caribbean. Its 78 acres resemble a bird in flight, with its head, tail, and two wings corresponding to the intercardinal directions.

The main residence and compound occupies the northeast point, and a pair of guest houses occupy the northwest and southeast points. The southwest point, however, features a very different kind of building.

The front is flanked by statues painted in gold; one of them appears to be the trident-wielding Poseidon, the Greek god of the sea, while two others look like birds perched on the corners of the roof. It is surrounded by a line of palm trees and a terrace with a labyrinth motif. Finally, the exterior seems to incorporate an optical illusion, to create the impression that the exterior windows and door are set within carved flanges.

Certain features of the "temple" raise even more questions. When INSIDER consulted James Both, a contractor and engineer based in Chicago, he first pointed to the wooden door. "It's styled like what you might see on a castle, with what appears to be a reinforcing lock bar across the face," he said. "What makes it peculiar is that if you wanted to keep people out, the bar would be placed inside the building, [but the] locking bar appears to be placed on the outside ... as if it were intended to lock people in."

https://www.insider.com/jeffrey-epstein-private-island-temple-2019-7?utm_source=copy-link&utm_medium=referral&utm_content=topbar&utm_term=mobile
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No. 24435
>>24432
>we're beasts all the same
no, if that was true society wouldn't exist, society and rule of law would in fact be obsolete. but humans are social animals. highly criminal, psychotic people such as dutroux are considered negative among all humans regardless of cultural background, because they are a dangerous anomaly of human nature. human beasts must hide their nature and be "clever" (that's different from being "smart" or "intelligent") when they act like beasts.
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No. 24436
>>24434
>Is that really a temple on his private island?
could as well be a particular ugly spa or something. the guy is eccentric to say the least, so he has certainly eccentric taste in ugly architecture, too.
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No. 24437
>>24436
Do the white and blue stripes remind you of anything?
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No. 24438
>>24435
So if left you alone with a pile of resources you could somehow leverage for benefit, and there was a zero percent chance of getting caught. Your fingers wouldn't be even the slightest bit sticky? Or hell, if people are totally fixed on the existence of rules, then that means that nobody will smoke dope if its illegal, even if they enjoy it? Take that to a larger scale and it starts to become clearer. Society functions the way it does by the fact that you don't toe the line and you get your shit pushed in, i.e working the survival instinct. It's not really that different at its core to how an alpha rules a pack of apes, do as he (society) says or get dunked on. We're big brain apes, and while it don't mean we're all pedos, I don't believe for a second that most of us don't have something illegal that they'd do given the opportunity to get away with it. That's my point. It's not that power corrupts, it's that power is a means to do whatever the fuck you want, and most of us have at least something that isn't entirely socially acceptable, even if it isn't being pedo-tier garbage.
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No. 24442
>>24437
Russian navy sailor uniforms
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No. 24459
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>>24434
>>24437

AOE2 unironically
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No. 24462
26 kB, 367 × 469
>>24438
If I were a billionaire financier I would simply spend my money on model trains and power tools instead of renewing forgotten covenants with ancient evils in a gilded rape temple

Bet you didn't think of that huh
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No. 24463
>>24462
But that's not how you keep making even more money, and if you are that rich, that's the only thing that matters.
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No. 24464
>>24462
I dunno if you can get that rich in finance without touching dirty money. Not judging in that respect by the way. It'd get cleaned some way, might as well be you who gets the payday after all. Assuming you just assume the mantle of instant billionaire, would you really not offshore that crap?

It's not even on the same scale as being into freaky pedo cultist shit like this fulla but the instinct to maintain what one has is pretty strong. Even as a billionaire, seeing hundreds of thousands go down the drain to tax must sting a bit.

>>24463
I feel like if you go into finance in general, you just have to have an autistic fascination with watching numbers go up.
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No. 24465
>>24442
>>24459
He was trying to get at Epstein being Jewish but it doesnt really remind me of a Synagogue or the style of the Second Temple. Having it flanked by Poseidon would also be an odd choice for a Jewish temple.

From all of what I've read the main thrust ultimately seems to be a mixture of Judaic heresies and some kind of occult and Satanic group hidden within Judaism. If you read between the lines of Protocols of Zion it seemingly indicates this as well. For starters, why on earth would a Jewish conspiracy style itself as the head of a serpent, above and unknown by the rest of the Jewish people? You have to be kind of fluent in both the occult and Christianity to make sense of it I think, as well as Judaism. For starters the ouroboros, or serpent eating it's own tail, is a pretty frequently used and well known occult symbol. In context of the Zion theory of course it would be the "serpent" conquering nation after nation circumnavigating the world until returning triumphantly to where it started. However, why on earth would one ever dream of using a serpent then as the symbol? Serpents and vipers are well known to not be positive symbols in Abrahamic religions. This becomes clearer when you remember that in Genesis, the serpent beguiles Eve, whose name loosely translates to "life" and that it is cursed by God and then God declares that it shall bruise the woman's heal and the woman shall crush its head. Now in this context, why on earth would one call themselves the head of the serpent?

To address his Jewish insinuation bluntly it's because this is not a bunch of Jews, but rather a secret inner clique of occultists, who are also called the Synagogue of Satan. I'm not entirely sure the reason so many Jews seem to be unaware of this including use of the hexegram as a national symbol, except for some odd view on Solomon. Regardless, it is because I think there was some truth to Protocols, and that what it reveals is the centrally occult nature of this group, and also an awareness in that in Christian circles the serpent is often seen synonymous with sin and that the whole symbolic attribute of this episode in Genesis is specifically a prophesy on the woman giving birth to the Savior who will eventually crush Satan, as well as being the destruction of this Satanic movement. It does however appear to me that this group is loathe to have both that nature within "Judaism" ever be connected to the concept of the Illuminati, which at once exposes them not just as Satanists but as a heresy that has concealed itself within Judaism as false Jews who have been operating in perpetuity since the Babylonian exile, and that these are a group of manipulators with little regard for Jews either who simply adopted the ways and religious beliefs of the Babylonians while casting aside faith in Judaism and that they have been adopting and fine tuning their understanding of various strands of the occult ever since.

It furthermore exposes the complete truth in longstanding accusations about this so called "Illuminati" also operating massive child abuse rings and probably brainwashing in addition to manipulating global finance. What else is not normally connected is why these people would both be what poltards usually think of as "the Jews did it" while also understanding it was the exact same group of people who backed Hitler and financed his rise to power, in which case the question would be, why? And the answer is because they aren't even Jewish to begin with, in the same sense as that it is highly likely Adolf Schiklgruber really was in fact the bastard of a Rothschild, and that that is partly why they allowed him to become the head of the NSDAP and had been secretly grooming him for this position all along, as well as partly explaining the occult core of the Nazis particularly the SS and their early occult origins.

All of this is because they're actually an occult movement, masquerading as a Jewish one, masquerading as a million other things, meanwhile every year Satanism and the occult gets more and more popularized and made mainstream. As for the various secret orders, they really are groups of occultists, not controlled by "the Jews" but rather controlled by higher and more tightly controlled levels of the occult, including but obviously not limited to Rosicrucians, the OTO, the Golden Dawn, Scientology, Mormonism, Great White Brotherhood sponsored New Age groups, and for reasons I do not understand Jehovas Witnesses.
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No. 24466
750 kB, 1024 × 767
>>24463
Not if you can somehow convince people to keep buying more and more of said model trains at exorbitant prices as well as frequently expanding your licenses and charging through the nose on DLC and book materials
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No. 24468
>>24466
I was actually very surprised when they released the standalone Kill Team game. The boxed set was actually pretty good value (including a game's worth of cardboard terrain, a long-requested product), and the small size of teams made it more affordable than the main game while also being a kitbasher's wet dream. GW's PR is also really great nowadays. I was away from the scene for a long time and was looking at kits to bash together for a retinue for Inquisitor, and they actually communicate with the community now and provide tutorials for painting etc. as good will generators.

I have this weird optimism about the company. Main line 40k will probably live on as the bloated mess it is for a while still, but between AoS and KT which are both successful flagship games for them now, I'm seeing them move a bit back towards older editions of the games which were a bit more scaled back. I think it'd be a wise move for them.
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No. 24481
>>24434
The birds are an interesting touch. They look like cockatoos or something similar. Can't really find some religious reference to them but the island of Dominica (not far from the Virgin Islands) has a pair of parrots as its coat of arms. Poseidon is more affiliated with horses so this is an odd choice. Maybe he tried to reference Hera, but she's represented by peacocks or cuckoos. Still, a very unusual pairing.
And yeah, odd to have a Jewish (or Abrahamic) temple and have a Greek god sitting front and center. Some old Christian artwork co-opted pagan imagery but not so boldly.
Maybe the guy's developed his own weird esoteric religious tenets and only his buddies really "get" the meaning.
Then again the whole optical illusion aspect is so pointless that I'm inclined to believe he built it just to fuck with people. Can't deny that if I was rich I would be tempted to have a spooky Satanic temple just for a laugh.
Or maybe it's an artistic statement. Something about fake depth, seeing horizons where there are none, mass and direction implied through 2-dimensionality.
The second structure might make more sense of it.
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No. 24483
331 kB, 1824 × 1216
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>>24481
It honestly looks to me more like the sort of thing someone into something like the Golden Dawn would build
http://www.aeclectic.net/tarot/cards/golden-dawn-temple-meditation-set/
http://hermanubisgoldendawn.blogspot.com/2019/01/taking-portal-oaths-between-pillars.html
The very front entrance to the building looks like an Hierophant's headdress with the door where his face would be.

I'm not specifically bashing the G∴D∴ either, particularly since this is the sort of behavior I'd more expect of an OTO black lodge or something or Berlusconi's P2 for that matter but just saying. It all would look a bit odd and out of place unless you realized the possibility of magicks fags along with it. It would still be a series of really odd choices imo but all those weird seemingly mismatched things together would make perfect sense in the context of like a Golden Dawn temple or whatever.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qRGf9oKalk

Of course, I also personally don't think that the G∴D∴/R∴C∴ or OTO is that significant or particularly influential in any way. I do however think that there's some magickal current and group of hidden orders that I don't know about on the upper echelons that's seemingly influential at least in media and entertainment, and that said group(s) are responsible for everything from the shittiness of what rap turned into, to death metal including Burzum, to numerous metal, pop, and other influences. I'll have to play Asscreed games someday too just to see what the story is about (the motto itself is ripped directly from Thelema which in turn gave Wiccans their "Wiccan reed" which was a sort of exteriorization and mainstreaming of it marketed to teenage girls)
wait wut
>dark angel Gabriel
huh?
>>
No. 24484 Kontra
>>24483
>Burzum
>death metal

For fucks sake, stop talking about extreme music. You clearly don't know what you're talking about.
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No. 24486
>>24484
Black metal whatever. Also
>extreme music
Lol this is not a genre or type of music.
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No. 24489
>>24486
It might not sound different to you, but even a few minutes of research would have tought you that the scene is entirely different.
People in death metal tend to be energetic and wreckless and want to have fun, people in black metal take themselves serious, sit around being gloomy and generally despise everyone who is in a good mood.
Exceptions exist.
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No. 24491
57 kB, 750 × 551
Apparently the YouTube personality Stefan Molyneux is using the Epstein case as an excuse to relitigate the blood libel. A few thoughts:

  1. Is this even true? We don’t have a full list of victims and he recruited girls from around NYC so odds are some of them were Jewish.
  2. Isn’t Molyneux himself of partial Jewish descent?
It’s unfortunate that extremists are trying to blame all Jews for Epstein’s crimes, but totally predictable.
>>
No. 24493
>>24491
Molyneux is another example of a completely useless person. He's also so fucking dumb that he doesn't realize for starters how many kids are abused by Orthodox Jews who are Jewish
https://www.newsweek.com/2016/03/11/child-abuse-allegations-hasidic-ultraorthodox-jewish-community-brooklyn-432688.html
We also don't know who these kids were except that one Australian woman and that they were mostly runaways and from problem homes. It also interestingly skirts by the fact his clientele included people like Prince Andrew, Bill Clinton, Donald Trump, and numerous oligarchs and other leaders who aren't Jewish. Also it isn't really blood libel and I hate it when this term is used more and more loosely. Blood libel is specifically the thing accusing medieval Jews of murdering Christian children and often involves baking them into matzo or something. It bothers me when apparently we can talk about things like Bohemian Grove or accuse world leaders of ritual sacrifice but suddenly it becomes more "problematic" when you insinuate so-called Jews are among them. The issue is when useless dumb fucks like molymeme try to insinuate it's just Jews.

2, I have no idea but was expecting that. Again pretty funny too how in all likelihood what's going to be protecting him are the non-Jews with amazing amounts of power and influence. The only Jewish client of his was Dershowitz. How I fucking loathe Dershowitz. But it also includes a lot of people where I don't hear anyone saying what's wrong with white people being a bunch of sick fucks or somethingthe non Jewish ones anyway Jews are white. Or how nobody talks about the British being a bunch of damn pedophiles when it's a known thing about the British elites including Jimmy Savile. Meanwhile at least Epstein is already a registered sex offender and he's been arrested a yet again.

What you're seeing here is the problems inherent to class. I forget the full list but it included some people like Richard Branson was it? A whole bunch of rich people getting named. Just like the Paradise Papers, and what happened with it? These guys act like they're untouchable because billionaires basically live by a completely different set of rules than poor people. It's like they're living on another planet and they definitely act like it. I also find it interesting how certain fucktards keep talking about Clinton only, while conveniently ignoring the fact that Acosta is the one who gave Epstein such cushy treatment to begin with and seemingly went out of his way to make arrangements no other criminal let alone a fucking sex offender would even be allowed, and meanwhile Trump is the who suspiciously elevated Acosta to a high office and keeps defending that guy. Why? Because Andrew, Epstein, Dershowitz, Clinton, Trump, all these guys are part of that same pizzagate club.
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No. 24498
>>24489
What also really pisses me off about that post is that people have been bitching about modern music for literally a century. It was nothing new then. It certainly isn't any different now. For fucks sake, Adorno wrote about how Jazz is an inherently vapid product of the culture industry. His main argument was from his essay "On Jazz" from 1936. In short, Adorno criticizes that while the content of solos, blue notes, syncopations and vibrati seems to allow for the freedom of expression, it is purely ornamental to the constraint of the form of the jazz standards (4 times 8 beats). This formal constraint to Adorno, who had studied composition, was a setback in comparison to more fluid structural techniques like the sonata-form or dodecaphonism. Adorno's critique isn't purely from the viewpoint of musical theory. Adorno criticizes what he calls Jazz Ideology. Jazz pretends to enable freedom, but it binds the individual to the rhythm of perpetual sameness and thus defangs any potential for revolution.

Naturally, Adorno was criticized for grossly oversimplifying, if not misapprehending, Jazz. One of his students, Jazz guitarist Volker Kriegel, remarked that Adorno didn't understand the slang of his musical advisor in New Orleans and that he dismissed acts that were recommended to him as "bad". Martin Seel used Adorno's book on composing for film to prove that the Jazz soundtrack to La Dolce Vita fulfilled Adorno's criteria for art, thus vindicating Jazz.

We get used to music being a certain way, and when it changes, it is upsetting. The human ear develops differently depending on what it is exposed to. Music of two thousand years ago sounds terribly dissonant and strange to us, and ours likely would to them. But another thing to think about: if people stayed committed to one musical structure and all the instrumentation that expresses it, how far do you think it could really stretch? It's just one idiom that will eventually be thoroughly been exhausted.

tl;dr: Adorno was an old fart.

And yes, "Extreme Music" is an umbrella for Extreme Metal, Extreme Goth (ie: Deathrock*), Noise, Industrial, Power Electronics, Hardcore Punk and all subcultures associated with such genres of music. This shouldn't be a hard concept to internalize, but for our Christian Anarchist here, this apparently doesn't quite sink in. Hell, you don't even have to get steeped into the culture through zines and all other peripheral material like I have. Just read a few books and it'll all make sense.

And how ANY of this has anything to do with Jeffrey Epstein, I'd really like to know.

*Deathrock ≠ Death Metal. Both entirely different genres.
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No. 24500
>>24489
I wasn't talking about that not being a distinct genre; I was talking about "extreme music" not being a distinct genre unless he meant like skinhead music or something.

>>24498
>And yes, "Extreme Music" is an umbrella for Extreme Metal, Extreme Goth (ie: Deathrock*), Noise, Industrial, Power Electronics, Hardcore Punk and all subcultures associated with such genres of music
lol you just got done going on some long winded tangent about jazz and finish with trying to put a wide variety of completely different genres under one label.

>This shouldn't be a hard concept to internalize, but for our Christian Anarchist here, this apparently doesn't quite sink in
What?

>Hell, you don't even have to get steeped into the culture through zines and all other peripheral material like I have. Just read a few books and it'll all make sense.
The only thing I see you keep posting is deathmetal.org

>And how ANY of this has anything to do with Jeffrey Epstein, I'd really like to know.
That's the entire topic of the thread
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No. 24504
>>24500
>lol you just got done going on some long winded tangent about jazz and finish with trying to put a wide variety of completely different genres under one label.
It's called broadstrokes. Yes, they're all different and have plenty of divisions within themselves as subcultures, but they all deal with uncomfortable and taboo subject matter and are usually harsh, dissonant genres of music that designed to repel all but the most committed of true believers. There are plenty of people into one particular genre that want nothing to do with the other genres, but the overlap within extreme music is almost ubiquitous that people who stay confined to one genre are less common than you think.

You claimed
>I do however think that there's some magickal current and group of hidden orders that I don't know about on the upper echelons that's seemingly influential at least in media and entertainment, and that said group(s) are responsible for everything from the shittiness of what rap turned into, to death metal including Burzum, to numerous metal, pop, and other influences.

That's quite the reach with regards to Metal. Where's the spooky string-pullers with regards to any genre within Extreme Metal? It's a genre that has undergone decades of evolution with musicians of all backgrounds playing their respective parts contributing to the direction of a given subgenre.

>The only thing I see you keep posting is deathmetal.org

Very well. Some books that are worth reading:

"Black Metal : Evolution of the Cult" by Dayal Patterson
"Swedish Death Metal" by Daniel Ekeroth and Chris Reifert
"Sounds of the Beast" by Ian Christie (take this one with a grain of salt)
"Louder Than Hell: The Definitive Oral History of Metal" by Jon Wiederhorn
"Mean Deviation: Four Decades of Progressive Heavy Metal" by Jeff Wagner
"METALION: The Slayer Mag Diaries" compiled by Jon Kristiansen
"Only Death Is Real: An Illustrated History of Hellhammer and Early Celtic Frost" (this one is more of a picture book, but it's a fun read all the same)

If you absolutely feel compelled to read "Lords of Chaos" by Michael Moynihan, take it all with a huge grain of salt.
https://everything2.com/user/Sol+Invictus/writeups/Lords+of+Chaos
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No. 24506 Kontra
>>24504
>"Louder Than Hell: The Definitive Oral History of Metal" by Jon Wiederhorn

Also, take this one with a big grain of salt since most of the book covers mainstream Metal as opposed to cult Metal. The others relate more to Extreme Metal.
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No. 24507 Kontra
>>24504
>>24506
Last, but not least, there's "Choosing Death: The Improbable History of Death Metal & Grindcore" by Albert Mudrian.

Personally, I felt that book was a bit disappointing. It's useful if you've never heard a single Death Metal album in your life, but it has absolutely nothing to offer for dedicated enthusiasts. Equally disappointing was the missed opportunities in that book. You would think a book about Death Metal would cover creative process behind the songwriting, but sadly, we see too little of that and much more of the business side of how things worked behind the scenes.

As much as Michael Moynihan's "Lords of Chaos" showed an outsider-looking-in perspective on this time black metal, Moynihan clearly being more of a goth/industrial person than a metal fan, at the very least its narrow focus on Norway in the early 1990s allowed it to go in depth.
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No. 24508 Kontra
>>24498
>>24500
Get a room, you two.
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No. 24511
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No. 24514
9 kB, 250 × 250
>>24511
>things that have nothing to do with Hillary
>things that provably do have something to do with Tr*mp
https://www.scribd.com/doc/316341058/Donald-Trump-Jeffrey-Epstein-Rape-Lawsuit-and-Affidavits
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No. 24518
>>24514
Y'all need to read that. I'll also point out that the charges are pretty much identical to what he's being charged with now.
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No. 24526
>>24514
Is that Orson Welles?
>>
No. 24528
>>24504
I've been gone the entire day and my head is killing me so to be brief, Burzum and the whole black metal/death metal/whatever scene but particularly black metal is quite clearly glorifying the Satanic. Like, that's their whole shtik. You try and act like you're somehow bewildered that anyone can think this and meanwhile
>"Black Metal : Evolution of the Cult"
>"Sounds of the Beast"
>"Louder Than Hell:
>Only Death Is Real: An Illustrated History of Hellhammer and Early Celtic Frost"
Like for real dude you're going to just sit there and tell me that fucking black metal of all things you don't see any of the not-so-hidden Satanic symbolism, imagery, and just general glorification of the demonic?

Or how about this
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forces_of_Satan_Records
I should also point out that the "black flame" is a slightly more obscure term. It really isn't actually that obscure to me, but apparently it's completely unknown outside certain circles with a very deep awareness of the demonic aspects of the occult and of Satanism. I like how to turned this into a complete derailment from OP's topic because of an aside I made about the Satanic nature of some of the sort of metal you seem to like.
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No. 24529
>>24528
>some of the sort of metal you seem to like.

Have I ever been anything other than very open about my admiration of Metal in general? I consider Black Metal among the genre's highest achievements. I'm less bewildered or angry and more annoyed that someone who clearly doesn't listen to the music acts like he's speaking truth to power.

>You try and act like you're somehow bewildered that anyone can think this

It's indisputable that Black Metal's primary lyrical themes, especially Second Wave Black Metal (ie: Norwegian Black Metal and all other international scenes influenced by it), were all about Satan and the occult. This is nothing new. Satan and the occult go all the way back to Black Sabbath themselves. The only new development here is that Satanism was a primary lyrical focus as opposed to a secondary one, and the bands' respective aesthetics went much further than Mercyful Fate or Venom ever had. Ásatrú and Norse mythology are also very prominent themes in Black Metal. The vast majority of the Burzum's* lyrics concerned Paganism and Tolkien as opposed to Satanism and the occult.

You, on the other hand, seem to believe the development of Black Metal (perhaps Extreme Metal in general) was the result of mysterious cabals of satanic string-pullers who also have ties to pedophile sex rings and world governments. Do I understand you correctly? To me, this is an absolutely crackpot theory with no evidence to substantiate it beyond vague references from different bands' respective lyrics and aesthetics. If you can prove that a vastly influential cult was responsible for the creation of Black Metal, then hats off to you and, for fucks sake, write a book because this is a startling discovery. Were the musicians capable and guilty of malicious and heinous acts? Absolutely. No argument there. To me, the actions of musicians associated with the scene were the result of idle rich edgelords high on their own supply rather than some grand conspiracy.

So there, that's my Occam's razor take on the subject. If you can credibly link Jeffrey Epstein's taste for underage girls to the cult that responsible for Black Metal's existence, GOOD FOR YOU! I forever stand corrected. I find it rich that you shit on Pizzagaters while also peddling this theory as if it were unvarnished truth. Really, what's the difference between them and you?

*As an aside, Burzum is praised so heavily (perhaps overly and misguidedly so) because the project strove to be something other than a tacky cliche. In the end, Varg was largely unsuccessful and became a meme himself, but he produced incredibly compelling music in the process. Strange you keep mentioning them as opposed to Mayhem, Gorgoroth, Immortal, Darkthrone, Carpathian Forest or any of the other major Norwegian Black Metal bands that are openly Satanic.
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No. 24536 Kontra
>>24528
>>24529
And, just so that we're clear, nobody's arguing that Black Metal wasn't rooted in Satan, Odin or the occult. The genre has since evolved to a point where artists can compose Black Metal without those themes, but that's neither here nor there.

The crux of this debate is whether or not Black Metal was some plot involving influential cults with deep ties to world governments and pedophile rings. I think it's the creative pursuits of bored rich edgy teens high on their own supply who took things much further than anyone would've suspected. No need for conspiracy. Some of these teens may earnestly worship Satan or take occult shit seriously, but blasphemy is Black Metal's lyrical mode of expression regardless of if the musicians sincerely believe in Satan or not.
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No. 24591
Just want to throw in one very obvious conclusion that you don't need to be a red-pilled tinfoil hat for:

child pornography is
a) very difficult to access
b) a very profitable market (according to estimatea of various national investigation forces)

You don't need to genius to understand who is the target group of that market.
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No. 24592 Kontra
>>24591
I did not read the thread nor did I do my research on rich people and (mediated) child abuse. But just because it's known to be a paying industry does not make it automatically a desired consumer object for rich people. Do we know the price of a video with whatever certain content I'm sure their exist fetishes just like for adults? Perhaps somebody who consumes it and has an average paying job has the money to afford it every once in a while, maybe even more often. Or are we talking about children kidnapped and then abused in a secret location by rich people? Because I guess the prices for these must be really high. Then again do proofs exist or is it a 100% speculative stories?

Drugs are paying industry as well, that does not mean only rich people consume it, they just have no problem in paying for it. There are suggestions made that seem to be built on flawed logics.
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No. 24593
>>24592
I can't remember if this was it
http://www.nbcnews.com/id/42108748/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/t/massive-online-pedophile-ring-busted-cops/
but there was one ring that got busted where some guy was paying $10,000 a video and wanted to watch the kid die
Oddly even links about it are dead now
https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=40222
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No. 24594 Kontra
>>24592
I was not necessarily implying poor people would not develop pedophilia and I just like the general concept of following the money in order to understand structures. Also, poor people are usually less organized than wealthy people, simply because they are on average educated better and simply have the necessary funds to organize. So if there is an organized crime market for child pornography and child sex trafficking, it would most probably involve a certain type of "elite" of the society. Simply because plebs are not capable of doing such a thing.
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No. 24598
>>24594
The drug business has many different participants as well. People who keep looking away get payed, material and info gets payed and so on. We don't really know how such a structure came into life on what financial basis, sure, a good organization is necessary and needs some money, but we don't know how much money really is necessary. Really rich people can generate new money from finance more easily and safe and legal, it's more suited to people who make a fundamental share from organized crime in the usual legal sense. And such people are not usually people born rich already.
If 10.000$ is a price for seeing a child die I said it's rather cheap, but it might be an unrealistic wish anyway.

I don't say rich people cannot be pedophiles but the argument is rather fragile up to now.

>>24593
I did not deny the existence of organized pedophilia and I'm aware that it exists, it's not the first 'found' as long as I remember following the news. Yet it nowhere says rich people organized it all.
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No. 24607
>>24598
>organized pedophilia
You should distinguish between pedophilia and child pornography/abuse
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No. 24608
78 kB, 658 × 518
How can people still doubt that the rich and powerful engage in pedophile conspiracies after observing the catholic church for the past ten years? If nothing else the church abuse scandal serves as a proof of concept for how these networks may exist within bureaucracies.
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No. 24612 Kontra
>>24608
>dumb frog shit on front page
>see Canadian post
Is cabbage leaking or something
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No. 24614
761 kB, 1199 × 924
>>24612
Actually neck yourself you logorrheic schizo retard. I’m tired of your walls of apophenic text, smug attitude and tendency to derail threads with utter nonsense. I will post the fucking disabled frog if I wish. Go lick the toilet seat at Zaxby’s you glass-brained cretin.
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No. 24619 Kontra
2,0 MB, 640 × 360, 0:18
>>24614
Who is even "you" you imbecile? There's at least 4 frequent USA posters here afaik. Judging by your immediate reaction I'd say, yup, that's a kohlburner alright. Don't turn this place into KC2017.