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„There is no place like home“

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No. 28480
94 kB, 1067 × 600
Man, why old school programmers and developers (Steve Jobs, Steve Wozniak, Linus Torvalds, Bill Gates and those 2 guys who made C) have much better reputation and reception than new age ones (Larry Page, Mark Zuckerberg, Jeff Bezos and etc)?

Why new age ones have so much scandals and much less inovation and development?
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No. 28484
Didn’t Stallman just get axed at MIT for defending Jeffrey Epstein? Also he’s engaged in public pedophilia apologia for years and has a reputation for harassing women at conferences.
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No. 28486
Because they started off in the heroic age of their industry, before things were set in stone. They are essentially the law-bringers of this little microcosm. Each giving something imensely influential to the world of technology. They are icons in their own right who brought us tools and "magic". Think Prometheus.
(Jobs especially had this prophet-like image well built up through marketing.)
Now, they weren't necessary the first ones to do what they did, but they got it "right".

In contrast, Bezos, Zuckerberg and the others aren't "founding fathers". They didn't build and shape the industry. They are only in it for the profit and power.
And not to mention, that Jobs's and Linus's work didn't result in a complete monopoly in a given industry, at least not for consumers.
Look at Zuckerberg's parasitic Facebook, furthering itself through your existence like some otherworldly bloodsucker that tries to make humanity a slave to its methods of expression.
Or look how Amazon is such a colossal company that it could replace every retailer in the US if it gave a fuck. (Think putting Walmart out of business.)
They are faceless gigacorporations intent on consuming and moulding the whole persona of its users.
You can't "look up" to their achievements on a personal level. They aren't "Great Men" who advanced their fields, even if those great men did so only in a capitalist sense.
You could get inspiration from the life of Jobs, Linus or Gates, but what the fuck is inspiring about Mark "They trust me, the dumb fucks" Zukerberg's life and "look at me, I am humanoid, I smoke the meats in my back garden" existence?
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No. 28488
>>28486
Great analysis, Ernst
Funny thing is in my opinion, how Steve (both of them), Linus and Bill are still humble and clean as water
They don't have much scandals

Indeed there are good new age guys with bright idea (Twitter and AirBnB) seems fine but they are overshadowed by cunts
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No. 28494
>>28488
I wouldn't call Jobs "clean as water", but you can't argue that he kickstarted the smartphone revolution, and he was good with branding and marketing. Good at marketing his products, and most importantly, himself.
Don't know about Gates. He always seemed like your run of the mill rich-person, though he wasn't extravagant and never in your face, which is a positive.

If I had to say someone who is pushing for innovation and seems "human", then I'd say it's Elon Musk, though I despise how people cream in their pants whenever "le cool Tesla man" tweets something.
(But I digress. The "fanbase" shouldn't devalue someone's achievements.)
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No. 28495
>>28480
Because Bill Gates and co. startet out as programmers when programming wasn't actually a career path that makes you a million dollars in your 20s.
They where working on a product and the company with its success came way later so they're programmer and ingeneer first and CEO second.
Somewhere in the last 20 to 30 years that turned around to CEO first product second.

>>28484
>Stallman

He's the odd one out no matter where you put him
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No. 28502
> programmers and developers
> Steve Jobs
That fucker forced Wozniak to do all the work while he smoked weed.

And great shame upon your family for not remembering at least K&R!

Torvalds at least still does programming.

> new age ones
None of those has done anything of value when it comes to programming.
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No. 28507
269 kB, 1280 × 1024
I think was is greatly overlooked ITT so far is that the one OP mentions as pioneers are people who are heavily involved in the spread of personal computers, whereas their followers are actually Internet entrepreneurs.
Still Jobs and Zuckerberg share the same sentiment for the Californian Ideology. Bezos founded Amazon in the 90s already I think.
So, what is suggested as a generational thing, is not really generational, they operate on different fields within information technology that's what they have in common despite the Silicon Valley spirit ofc.
Also Hungary is right that the innovation was really great, since WW2 cybernetics and the mathemization of the social made great leaps forward. But the "second generation" also did heavily influence the shape of the contemporary world today, so much for "innovation". And one last thing. The internet is associated heavily with Big Data, this dimension was not a thing in the 1980s/1990s.
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No. 28513
255 kB, 1024 × 1010
>>28480
Many of old ones mostly worked on things, which can be described as "baisc" (ha-ha). Same time most of them was pioneers of things when it was way before it became mainstream. When it was mostly thing with very limited audience, even most popular things - both on console and home computer side was considered by general audience or "something for children" or "something for tech professionals".

Current "big" computer corporations, same as huge web sites and platforms is something very deeply connected to regular audience, society and politics because everyone now using computers, playing videogames, visit internet resources. There not much pioneering, not much "limited audience" - but from "creating new tech in garage" it became like be head of big newspaper, or car industry manufacturer.

Everything that end up being "mass culture" thing soon or latter get into all this crap, since human society as per start of XXI centuary is degenerates.
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No. 28621
>>28502
>Torvalds at least still does programming.

Source for that? I seem to remember an interview with him where he sais the opposite is true.

>>28480
>and those 2 guys who made C
Fuck you sincerely for remembering goofs like Jobs but not actual programmers like Ken Thompson and Dennis Ritchie. Have to control myself here not to throw a tantrum.
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No. 28625
So apparently Stallman, having resigned from MIT, is now homeless and looking for a place to stay in the Boston area.

On one hand I get that he’s just some old computer science / maths genius who’s probably on the spectrum and tends to say some off-the-wall shit, and I don’t think he should be homeless, but you can’t outright condone the sexual abuse of women and children and expect to remain on the faculty at a world-class university.
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No. 28626
>>28625
>but you can’t outright condone the sexual abuse of women and children and expect to remain on the faculty at a world-class university.

As far as I could find out, he didn't. I'll take the chance and guess that you did not actually read the source material but are copypasting opinions here, correct?
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No. 28627
>>28626
One of Stallman's claims appears to have been misconstrued in the press: i.e., he says that it is likely Epstein coerced his victims into acting as if they were "entirely willing" participants in sex acts with his guests. This has been taken out of context to make it appear Stallman claims the victims were sincerely "entirely willing". However, he has also rejected the concept of statutory rape entirely, a position he has argued for at length on his personal blog. See this excerpt:

>The nominee is quoted as saying that if the choice of a sexual partner were protected by the Constitution, "prostitution, adultery, necrophilia, bestiality, possession of child pornography, and even incest and pedophilia" also would be. He is probably mistaken, legally--but that is unfortunate. All of these acts should be legal as long as no one is coerced. They are illegal only because of prejudice and narrowmindedness.

>Some rules might be called for when these acts directly affect other people's interests. For incest, contraception could be mandatory to avoid risk of inbreeding. For prostitution, a license should be required to ensure prostitutes get regular medical check-ups, and they should have training and support in insisting on use of condoms. This will be an advance in public health, compared with the situation today.

>For necrophilia, it might be necessary to ask the next of kin for permission if the decedent's will did not authorize it. Necrophilia would be my second choice for what should be done with my corpse, the first being scientific or medical use. Once my dead body is no longer of any use to me, it may as well be of some use to someone. Besides, I often enjoy rhinophytonecrophilia (nasal sex with dead plants).

28 June 2003 https://stallman.org/archives/2003-mar-jun.html

Furthermore it is implausible that Minsky would not have known that Epstein was grooming and trafficking his victims.
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No. 28633
I don't like the term "tech" or anything associated with it.

My favorite programmer is Niklaus Wirth. He designed many programming languages and OSes that were theoretically sound and aesthetic as fuck, but none of them caught on because of circumstance.
His data structure and algorithms book is really good too.
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No. 28635
>>28625
>you can’t outright condone the sexual abuse of women and children

he didn't
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No. 28640
>>28635
He didn't, but the american is right that it is outright retarded to raise such opinion (any controverse opinion) publicly while holding such a position.

Okay, it may be not if he would cover it up in a talk or something. But doing such by using two-liners in your (nearly) public universities mailing list is just challenging your administration to kick you out and also just asking the general public to misinterpreted your statements.
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No. 28649
>>28627
>For necrophilia, it might be necessary to ask the next of kin for permission if the decedent's will did not authorize it. Necrophilia would be my second choice for what should be done with my corpse, the first being scientific or medical use. Once my dead body is no longer of any use to me, it may as well be of some use to someone. Besides, I often enjoy rhinophytonecrophilia (nasal sex with dead plants).
Oh dear god he actually did really say that didnt he, especially
>necrophilia would be my second choice for what should be done with my corpse
Well, I personally would my bones converted into musical instruments, but still I mean just
Seriously dude? He may not have wanted to wrap that conversation into discussing a convicted pedophile pimp tied to his university. That alone demonstrates shocking incompetence.
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No. 28650
>>28649
> shocking incompetence
Or just maybe he said it a while back when you could discuss things on the internet without people going "OMG HE DIDN'T JUST SAY THAT OH SHIT THINK OF THE CHILDREN OR PETS OR WHATEVER I'M REALLY OFFENDED BY EVERYTHING".

What you could maybe blame him for is not caring about new things like Facebook where ordinary people with boring lives hang out to post pictures of their food. You know the ones who will lynch you for saying things that is offensive to them.

He also has a sense of humor that is apparently foreign to people in general and Americans more so.
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No. 28659
>>28650
We're talking about child molestation and international elite pedophile rings dude. For him to be taking things lightly in that context right now especially given the dumb shit he's said in the past, ESPECIALLY when it is right now impacting his very place of employment, is monumentally fucking stupid. If you're a pedophile from k*hl I don't expect you to understand this or the gravity of the situation.

The necrophilia remark on it's own is just bizarre, but when you take that kind of shit in context of him basically saying being a pedo is okay with that whole "but what if the child consents" pedophile argument then yes, it does look bad, and yes, people should be held accountable. Keep in mind we're not just talking about any one remark on the internet. It would be like if your college was embroiled in a scandal about crosses being burnt in front of a black college dorm and you made racist remarks in the past, yes it does look bad, especially if you're fucking stupid and tactless enough to think now is the time to start talking about black IQ scores. Of course someone doing that gets fired and frankly they probably should be fired for being that tactless and inept in dealing with the situation while their very employer has become a national focus.

And for the record, no, the argument itself he's trying to make is beyond stupid because you have to keep in kind the enforcement from an American perspective. You can't just write shit like that into the laws because then people are going to abuse the hell out of it and actual victimizers become harder to proesecute.

It's especially grossly stupid to defend the argument even if misquoted about them "asking for it" because that's literally what Epstein was doing with the children he was pimping to oligarchs and the rich and famous, and was the exact same argument that filthy dirtbag Dershowitz tried to use in defending Epstein, which was claiming these children groomed and then trafficked were somehow criminals themselves which is what pimps use to control their stables of victims.

Anyone with any sense should see that and frankly what a lot of the public feels is outrage about the handling of this whole case and dropping the hammer down fucking hard on these scumbags. Now is not the time for anyone even a beloved eccentric coder to start making usual pedo sorry "ephebophile" remarks basically defending that guy while your very institution of MIT is under the microscope about said pedophile oligarchs ties to it.

It's just flatly stupid of him.
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No. 28663
>>28659
Have you tried having less opinions? It's quite liberating not having to follow the script on what to say all the time.
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No. 28673
>>28659
>OMG I'M SOOOO OFFENDEND RIGHT NOW HOW CAN YOU EVER THINK....OH IT MAKES ME SOOO ANGRY YOU ARE FUCKING HITLER!!!

tl;dr

Again, he lives in a time where the Internet isn't a big deal and people would argue with him instead of lynching him. As they did. Nobody cares that he changed his mind.

In fact we should be thankful that he has shown us, yet again, that having the wrong ideas is deadly even if it was 30 years ago and you have changed your mind.
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No. 28685
>>28673
We're talking about context of child molestation, kohltard. It's not about being "offended" this is a pretty big deal to non-defective non-sick fuck humans and the added context is that Epstein's slimy lawyer tried using the argument that they were willing and consenting prostitutes as a legal argument to get a pedophile and pizzagate tier elite child pimp off the hook, who also had ties to MIT apparently which is currently under investigation.
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No. 28692
>>28685
Yea so? What ever that epstein guys lawers are using as argument RMS said that many years ago long before what ever drama is playing out in the US now. He revised his views later but that nobody cares about. It isn't right or wrong or an excuse, it is an explanation, something the word doesn't care about nowadays, or ever really.

You try to hang him out like some child molesting creep because of what he said. I'm giving an probable explanation as to why he said what he said when he said it. I maybe wrong but at least I like to understand why before I hang someone, and have no problem doing so. You just like to hang people who are strange.

> pizzagate
Ah shit.
Never mind, you are a fucking moron. Pleas die in a fire, promptly.
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No. 28693 Kontra
>>28692
You should be aware that there are multiple Americans replying to this thread just fyi
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No. 28695 Kontra
>>28693
And I feel sorry for them but my statement still stands.
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No. 28709
235 kB, 750 × 873
Do you guys have any clue why this is one of the most read pages currently? (The apple Pc one)
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No. 28711
>>28709
Yes, Apple users have no clue but can at least do interweb stuff. So they search things like "why no my pc apple works without power" and BOOM, Wikipedia article at the top.
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No. 28765
>>28711
To be fair to them, the general public is pretty retarded. I worked as computer help (not IT, not a codemonkey, I am not knowledgeable about the workings behind computers) and too often I have had to deal with people not fully typing the address (literally just typing facebook or google and wondering why nothing happens), having no understanding of file uploading, or being unable to get through the most basic of captcha.
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No. 28766
>>28765
>or being unable to get through the most basic of captcha
Is that why I get more captchas when I solve them correctly, because Google thinks I am a bot? xD
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No. 28767
>>28765
How could such a thing even be possible

Were they the elderly or boomers?
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No. 28776
>>28766
Maybe. Sometimes captcha goes full retard on me and says to click for buses in an image of a giant hill. Or sometimes I fastclick all the traffic lights even though it asks for cars and it lets me through anyway.
>>28767
It was mostly 30-40 year olds. Most people have a set routine of things they do online so I imagine that anything outside of opening YT is wizardry to them. But it's pretty depressing to see how many of them can't figure out something like Google's password recovery.
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No. 28781
>>28765
That is why I like Android and iPhone. Finally I can blame the user for installing shit.

"Why is my tablet slow?"
"That is because you installed a shitload of apps my dear."
"Can you fix it?"
"No, I don't know that system."
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No. 28883
>>28781
I'm jealous, they didn't let you just ignore it that easily. Though most of their problems were easily solvable things.
But sometimes they gave me smartphone questions. And usually I can fix them but just looking at all their junk data and notifications makes me ill. If those phones were human, they would turn anyone pro-euthanasia.
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No. 28946
>>28883
I first tried to charge people. Turns out people are actually willing to pay so it didn't work. So just playing stupid works better, they understand stupid.