/int/ – No shittings during wörktime
„There is no place like home“

Currently at Radio Ernstiwan:

Hail Odin! by Christenklatscher666


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No. 31886
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Old one autosage >>4705

Some nice music documentary about the German alternative Rock scene of the 60s and 70s, also known as Krautrock.

Krautrock - The Rebirth of Germany

Here's a little shorter video about Krautrock as well.
No. 33961
Old documentary on Vietnam war

Is there any good documentaries on Russian war in Afghanistan?
No. 33983
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Sid!: By Those Who Really Knew Him

A documentary about Sid Vicious from the Sex Pistols.
One of the more tragic and interesting figures in music history.

No. 34018
C'mon, he was a gormless wally
No. 34020
Look what the Bri'ish music industry was shitting out decades ago and people still can't shut up about like ‎Freddie Mercury or Paul McCartney. Compared to such bland characters i would really call Sid Vicious interesting.
No. 34023
Documentary about kohlpark
This makes me realize if we could find a medical way to deal with these people it would probably also end up being the cure for homosexuality. How do you think modern Western society would react to that if one day we came out and said "here is the cure for homosexuality, pedophilia, and other sexual aberrations"?
No. 34027
It's produced by the francophone Switzerland's TV but "Passe-moi les" jumelles has some nice documentaries if you have an hour to waste. It's in french but you don't really need to speak french to watch some of their docs.
I recommend the one about a Swiss guy who lives like a prehistoric man several months per year in Yukon, it's just a guy who wants to rediscover the simplicity of being a part of his environment and he specifically says he's not a survivalist. There's another one about a dude who toured the world by bike and the documentary follows him in Tajikistan or another "stan" I don't remember sorry. All of this is on YT, just search for "passe-moi les jumelles"
No. 34156
There's a channel you can watch on art restoration that is very relaxing and takes you in:

He even does episodes without narration if you just want to hear the work.
No. 34165
Of course it's in Florida.
No. 34206
60 minutes is tabloid-tier. It's the TV equivalent of clickbait. Not a documentary. It could be accurate to an extent, but take everything said with a massive grain of salt.
No. 34249
I just find the concept of treating pedos by rewiring their brains interesting particularly given the inevitable hysteria that will follow because it would likely also unlock the secrets to "curing" homosexuality. That one fat boomer though is a perfect example of why a majority of pedos should just be stoned to death. I've had the misfortune of talking to..."people"..like that. They sincerely think nothing is wrong with them and try justifying their behavior and saying kids "give them the look" all while knowingly perfectly well they are engaging in manipulative and predatory behavior, and not just impulsive but well planned out premeditated evil.
No. 34253
Already got a perfectly fine cure though. Steel cap to the temple and/or teeth on the gutter. Why the fuck would I want to 'help' the scum in any way? Legit question. I dont know what kind of slob thinks that you can rehabilitate sick fucks like pedos and rapists.
No. 34311
The idea probably being it would be easier to deal with them if we can cure them rather than them all going underground to be sick fucks. If we can say here's a way to make you normal that might do more good than waiting until one of them is caught doing something illegal and harming others. A bit naive I know. Plus the other problem are the ones who dont want and would refuse such help which is likely to be a good many. Those yeah should get the death penalty.
No. 34907
I mean seriously just what kind of a pathetic non-life must you actually be to be spending this much time on a weekday to be working this hard at crapflooding a completely obscure imageboard that only has less than a dozen people on it?
No. 35438

15 minutes video following an Albanian shepherd through the mountains. very cozy.
No. 36711
How poor people survive in the USA | DW Documentary:


While watching it I had to think of the American(s) here, who say that the US is fucked. The homeless parking lot in the beginning. It's the "dark" site of American exceptionalism indeed. Cannot understand this country. To me the American ideology as a capitalistically charged one always seemed to be centered around the individual and we see how it cashes in with at this cost and going the full way with its consequences. It's not like Europeans have not taken a similar root, but the welfare state idea still stands, thankfully, but it's in retreat.
No. 36712
was there even a single 'documentary' that wasn't propaganda?
No. 36713 Kontra
what is propaganda and how does it differ from other media content? Or do you just want to say that every mediation is not the real and thus propaganda? Welcome to the simulation is all I can give in response then.
No. 36714
in general propaganda is brainwashing and showing things in the light you want instead of how they really are

also positive propaganda exist - for instance the chinese documentaries state explicitly that they're made by the chinese ministry of propaganda (or communist's party, don't remember). they don't try to hide it.

but most propaganda is "hidden"
No. 36715
In general you, as a Westerner, are solely exposed to positive US propaganda and 90% of the time it's disguised. I think I mentioned this before how even I have this weird nostalgia about the US and red cups and happy fun American suburbs that is completely alien to my personal experience and I'm from here. I don't have a problem with the occasional "propaganda" piece showing my country's negative side which is indeed profound. And besides, most propaganda has at least a kernal of truth to it. The Soviet machine made propaganda about lynching black Americans saying here is your freedom and equality. It doesn't make it wrong even if it is Soviet or RT propaganda in fact the main reason propaganda often works to begin with is telling uncomfortable truths. For example, the Norks and Chinese bombed our troops with pamphlets asking black Americans is this really the country you want to be dying for by talking about the overt racism of the country in the 50s. Really good propaganda doesnt shovel bullshit, only the truth. What often makes it propaganda is simply because it is omitting the other side, in which case to get a clearer picture sometimes you just listen to propaganda from both sides to have a pretty clear idea of what's really going on between the biases.

Speaking of which, I would like to add that you are confusing "biases" with propaganda. They are not the same thing.

Thanks I'll have to watch it at some point and tell you what I think. I'm balancing a cup of coffee on my lap on the bus so I can't right now.
No. 36717
>showing things in the light you want instead of how they really are.

how to determine the things as they really are?
To be fair most people don't ever think about the mediation of reality and thus need a sticker on the product they are consuming that due to countless choices in a selection process the consumed media product might not be the total mirror of reality it might suggest. I think brainwashing is wrong as the intention is more or less unconscious. Liberal democratic journalists will condemn dictators for oppressing people. I think documentaries, despite various "manipulative" techniques, can work as empirical material. So a 3rd world opression on camera really is an oppression. You might object that XY (dicator) is support many great programs for the social group of P. That might be and it is still left out from the documentary, because it's about the oppression of social group G.

I lately read that in sociology the category of interest is seen as neutral, whereas in common language we associate something immoral with it.
No. 36718
>Speaking of which, I would like to add that you are confusing "biases" with propaganda. They are not the same thing.

then you're confusing critique with 'propaganda'.

propaganda is 80-90% lie
No. 36724
>how to determine the things as they really are?

when you're not planing to make something malicious (so not typical propaganda) its rather easy, tho its never objective maybe

for propaganda you simply need to show things as coarse as possible to please the side you're working for or being part of

>So a 3rd world opression on camera really is an oppression.

maybe oppression doesn't exist tho
No. 36726
For German speaker:
>Tokyo Idols - Die Pop Girls von Japan
Told very comfy without annoying narration.

If you don't watch it immediately, save it with (Mediathekview), it's only available till 13.01.2020.
No. 36734
>tho its never objective maybe

I was asking myself if such a claim you made does imply a lost objectivity for everything. I looked up wikipedia on propaganda and propaganda technique and the result is
>well than everything could be labeled propaganda

It resonates well with constructive concepts, be it of social or perceptive kind.


>The old "ship" is just a concept in the human mind. Similarly, the new "ship" (that has had all its parts replaced) is another concept in the human mind

Can you elaborate on that? At first I thought it's a nietzschean kind of critique of language, seems to be something different.
There are no universals or what does it say?
No. 36743
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Okay so I'm only a few minutes into this video of yours (I'm positive I watched the first ten before so I skipped ahead) and seeing how you're now all arguing over what is propaganda I paused somewhere after 15 minutes just to say, no, this isn't propaganda in the least. That is literally exactly what it is like. I have been homeless before. Yes it sucks but the primary reason it sucks to begin with is because you get hassled by cops constantly and frankly I showed me firsthand what scum and filth the people in this country often are. I to this day slightly frown on a coworker I otherwise like because she can be such a bitch to homeless people. Fucking with the homeless and the working poor is the third easiest way to lose respect points with me, right behind hurting dogs and being a child abuser in that order.

The one thing I suspect was a lie though was about hotels. This is actually bullshit. I sincerely doubt she got a hotel and may have simply said that to save face in front of the cameras that her kids had to sleep in a van that night. Even cheap hotels are like 80 bucks a night and you need a card card for most of them. It doesn't matter if you're paying in cash. You absolutely have to have a credit card to rent a car, rent a hotel, buy a house and buy a car among other things even if you're paying in cash. In fact my great grandfather was so incensed by this I think he flat out refused to buy a new car from the dealer when this started happening. He tried to buy a model T or something and was told it didn't matter if he was paying cash he had to have a credit card. Actually it's only after I see that typed out I realize I'm exactly that way and how much it utterly pisses me off and how I adamantly refuse to do anything but pay in cash for everything though I digress. So on the off chance that woman got a hotel she was probably maxing out whatever cards she hadn't maxed out yet, and I'm struggling not to openly go ranting about usury and the certain people owning the banks who are bleeding my countrymen dry but I digress again. every banking executive needs to be lined against a wall and shotalso when I put my money in a bank that is me giving you a loan. You are taking out a loan from me, the customer, at highway robbery interest rates, to loan that money out to someone else at 27% interest rates. Where's my vig you cocksuckerssome small banks and credit unions are actually pretty cool tbh but Bank of America and HSBC executives literally deserve to be set on fire and filmed ISIS style with a TV screen so they can watch themselves burn to death

The thing about the Sheriff's is also 100% accurate. American policing is broken up into the local PD, State Troopers who basically handle the highways, SWAT which used to only be for hostage crisis and basically armed robbery and terrorism but for some reason is now openly used for the pettiest reasons and have a habit of murdering peoples dogs in front of childrenliterally. Remember that part where I mentioned respect points and dog abuse? I hate these people for a reason https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WF2nM9wsBYs and then there is feds like BATF and FBI who normally only handle major shit and things happening across state lines (most things the CIA gets accused of doing is actually the FBIs jurisdiction, not theirs) and finally there is the local Sherriff's office.

I think that in order for you non-Anglos to understand the Sherriffs you have to understand their historical origin in feudal times as basically the cunts carrying out duties for the local lord upon the serfs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheriff
Hence, the Sherriff is more involved in things like kicking people out of their homes and being the enforcement arm for landlords. Which when I say it like that, yeah, it's basically modern feudalism in America.

Regarding Sherrif officers I want you to understand two things, and the first one is that I actually had a boss on one of my construction jobs who used to be a Sherrif. He was a major cunt tbh which does kind of make me wonder to what extent people who stay Sherrifs are soulless subhumans because for all his faults he did leave for moral reasons. My old boss actually had to evict people nonstop and he finally outright quit his job after having to forcefully remove an old lady. I think he was envisioning a help old women across the street and stop bad guys thing for himself but what it boiled down to was throwing grandmas out on the street and trashing their stuff. So yeah I had a boss who left his career after a couple years when he finally had it and got so disgusted and sick to his stomach about that job he couldn't take it anymore.

The second thing I want you to understand is the very real societal tension simmering in America, and the kind of resentments against cops. I know some dumb motherfuckers will try and tell you oh its black this hurr durr nogs that but the reality is cops are hated here by a wide swath of the public, and at the same time there's this weird dynamic where some cops like the black lady and those sherrifs all act like hey it's the system and what are you gonna do, which itself creates this really weird dynamic of fatalism. I think a lot of people just accept how horrific the system is and don't even bother thinking of anything possibly being different st this point. At the same time you have a very angry, very alienated, very fractured, and very divided citizenry just boiling with massive amounts of tension that you frequently see erupting into chaos and violence on a weekly basis as another person here finally just snaps. Sometimes they get creative like the guy with killdozer who I gotta hand it to him he deserves some credit for that, and of course that guy finally snapped because of economic reasons too

I was wrong but oh God I didnt know this part
>"God built me for this job," Heemeyer said in the first recording. He also said it was God's plan that he not be married or have a family so that he could be in a position to carry out such an attack. "I think God will bless me to get the machine done, to drive it, to do the stuff that I have to do," he said. "God blessed me in advance for the task that I am about to undertake. It is my duty. God has asked me to do this. It's a cross that I am going to carry and I'm carrying it in God's name."[20]
Hahaha I rate killdozer guys statement a solid takbir out of inshallah.
No. 36745 Kontra
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So yeah in summation just the first 15 minutes are in general incredibly accurate, and no, the portion of the population that is either poor or has been outright homeless at some point is not some insignificant fringe. This ironically is also basically what got the current POTUS elected was pandering to just one cross section of those working poor. I'd say that the claim of Democrats likewise pandering to another demographic such as poor blacks is also accurate, and that neither party has ever done fuckall but continue with government gibs and fucking everybody else in the ass but I don't want to even approach that can of shitshow. Point being, only 15 minutes in I can tell you it is not propaganda, it is completely accurate, I know this not just in my personal experience but having been surrounded by poor people all my life, that yes it is possible to dig out like my one HS buddy who literally grew up in a shack made of particle board somehow got married and a mortgage on a house he "owns" from the bank (no idea current status though haven't heard from him in 7 years), and also it is true that you either can fall very far very fast and that is part of the tension in society of being on broken leg hospital visit away from becoming those people in a van, or simply not getting ahead at all.

I would personally say that our economic climbing is mostly a myth though. It's kind of like winning the lottery or some big prize. I mean yeah Zuckerbergs happen, and so do people getting ahead, but you don't pay attention to those 3 out of 4 people who lose and often lose hard. Class mobility isn't a thing for a lot of people and it is infuriating to me how much it has gone from being able to work your way up in the company to now basically either being outsourced or lateral movement. Like you just don't become CEO after working there since a kid. That's a myth. That was being a kid in like 1940s or more boomer bullshit. You get low shit work and stay low. If you work hard you get to be district manager, maybe. Important people get sourced from outside the company a lot of the time, CEOs come from paying headhunters to find somebody, and Joe Everyman with the broom and mop isn't working his way up anymore for the most part.

Frankly it's all one big fat scam.

as an aside I had a meeting today where the presenter was basically saying how she's shocked at how people just slam doors in each other's faces now and "I guess chivalry really is dead" but the interesting thing is she said she's ashamed to admit it but she largely noticed people in her age group doing it: boomers. She's cool but boomers have been going completely mental and caustically self centered

Oh fuck almost forgot one last thing
>if you don't get all your shit out in a day we're driving it to a landfill and making you pay for it
>yeah, after we kicked you out on the street with nowhere to go because you can't pay rent now we're going to charge you the cost of throwing your shit out
This is some insane Chinese Communist shoot you and charge the family the cost of the bullet tier bullshit and it's the norm here, which is partly why everybody is so constantly infuriated and ready to snap in this country. You have no idea the nonstop parade of absolute bullshit like this one must put up with. That landlord in particular is a fat cunt who is just like any other easily identifiable fat greedy cunt in this country. I will also so that what makes it so utterly bizarre is the way all of this is blended into the culture of customer service, which becomes this nightmarishly perverse thing where some people are treated like shit by clientele because it's the one time they have total power over another and can act like a spiteful petty tyrant, and then that person gets off work and acts like a cunt too and the cycle continues. For the most part like 90% of people are actually fine though and I think our culture of customer service and tipping is one of the few things that acts as a societal release valve and necessary glue holding this godawful mess together.
No. 36756
>everything could be labeled as propaganda

in general sense yes, but its kind of dump
im mostly talking about professional malicious propaganda, that you can see at DW or euronews say
thats targeting the average pleb

its simply a flattery basically saying to plebs that they're cool and hip and the others are niggers, so they will enjoy it more at sheklestones' factories


well its a metaphor, basically i meant you're trying to look at things from european point of view, that realistically may hold no water back in 3rdworld shithole anyway

ask average person in 3rdworld shithole if he likes his country, 80% will say its fine, maybe salaries are low tho, they like it there

ur "liberal" journalist are showing to you what you want to see, and showing others in a bad light
if its how he "sees" - its also how he earns money and stays in profession, he's basically a party member
No. 36759
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every time i hear about boomers i think about these people


basically people who built dam but were still too iq89 to keep their kindom/empire (in sort of naturally rich region with kind of easy life)
No. 36770
>in general sense yes, but its kind of dump
im mostly talking about professional malicious propaganda, that you can see at DW or euronews say thats targeting the average pleb

>its simply a flattery basically saying to plebs that they're cool and hip and the others are niggers, so they will enjoy it more at sheklestones' factories

You are just giving some thesis and garnish it with pol tier board speak, tell me more about how the others are doing propaganda and using propaganda techniques again. Ofc DW and others are framing, but what are you doing different? Nothing. You don't even reason, so far we were getting worked up what propaganda means and not what actually propaganda is concretely. You could explain where in that doc you see your thesis at work.

>so they will enjoy it more at sheklestones' factories

how does that even link to

>its simply a flattery basically saying to plebs that they're cool and hip and the others are niggers

>well its a metaphor, basically i meant you're trying to look at things from european point of view, that realistically may hold no water back in 3rdworld shithole anyway


>The ship of Theseus (also called Theseus Paradox) is a philosophical paradox that was already pointed out in antiquity. It touches on the question of whether an object loses its identity when many or even all of its individual parts are replaced one after the other.

I don't see how that Ship of Theseus is a metaphor for seeing things in the US or where ever from a European POV. I think you don't understand the ship thing yourself.

But anyways you made clear what you think it is

>showing to you what you want to see

What do I want to see?
You could say the same for Russian TV, Italian TV, Chinese TV etc.

> its how he "sees"

YOU DON'T SAY? I was thinking a documentary mirrors a totality, like you can deduce the absolute from it.

You could say it's framing. But anyway there are people living in the US in cars as homeless people and in tents on the street. I've seen YT videos of amateurs showing tents in LA last year or in 2018 as well. But I guess that's just Shacklestein making money and trying to lullaby me into submission or spending money on what exactly?

Besides all the nebulous gibberish do you ever heard of social problems? That a society can detect what is called problems? And that these are thought of as to be solved because something is not working as intended. Yeah a problem is normatively charged and it's a conflict between different parties, society is basically conflict ridden, which means people argue against each other.
You can ofc always resume back to thinking that somebody is trying to make things look bad all the time and concentrate on this simple image of how things work in a society, instead of developing a sense for more complex explanations of societal structuration.
No. 36771 Kontra

>You could say it's framing. But anyway there are people living in the US in cars as homeless people and in tents on the street.

Framing is to me that: People are homeless, living in their cars, or in tents on the street. That's a fact. What is done is interpreting this empirical data. And that is where the conflict potential comes in.
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i guess you can't explain things to a dense 14yo like youself who only understands things literally

no wonder you enjoy propaganda tho :)
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No. 36775
>this fuckin guy
>calling people dense 14yo
If you're the same as>>36759
which you seem to be, you are genuinely retarded.
No. 36778
whats your point tho

if you don't like my posts that doesn't make germanballs arguments any better

also it was only shitposting lol you both seems dense
No. 36779 Kontra
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>also it was only shitposting lol you both seems dense
No. 36780 Kontra
yes you could have posted this for yourself too

its indeed was shitposting however i never ever participate in serious discussions
No. 36782 Kontra
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Funny, it's another Germanball

>i never ever participate in serious discussions

Cool story, brudi.
No. 36786
Well now that we have established this whole discussion was sparked by literal shitposting I guess I'll just conclude by saying no, this video the German poster isn't even remotely propaganda. I honestly almost wondered if you weren't just shitposting but fatposting through a proxy

But oh God, that one woman with her "I'm afraid of bugs" and all these damned yuppies sleeping on a lawn. You know what especially makes this unrealistic? Because they weren't arrested or hassled by cops, ever. Try even taking a nap on someone's hippity hoppity. To this day one of the things that's made me angry IRl was someone gave this one homeless dude $100.00 and the fucking Brueggers wouldn't let him buy any food. They flat out refused to sell him food even though he wasn't even begging in front of their store, so fuck that corporation.

Lastly I'd like to point out this part
Yes that is also actually true. In most places in this country if you eat food from a trash can you'll be arrested for stealing. Lots of cops will often look the other way as long as you never stop walking and just keep moving around, since you'll pretty much be told to leave or be arrested virtually anywhere not a public library it's probably a sad commentary that sounds like hyperbolic and unbelievable Soviet propaganda but literally 90% of the people in American libraries are homeless people because it's the one place you won't be arrested, and the other 10% is either college students or very poor people filling out job apps on corporate websites or whatever because they can't afford a computer but they don't stay long. The year is 2020AD, 40 years in the future in America, and only the homeless ever visit libraries, packed in there hiding from the cops.

I actually first had this explained to me at some shit food job. If something is getting thrown out because it's around the expiration date, then the only loophole to take it home and eat it is catching it in mid air, because if you take it before the trash can then you're stealing from the company regardless if it's thrown out or not, and if you take it after it lands in the trash can you're stealing from waste management companies, but technically it's not stealing if you grab trash in mid air before hitting the receptacle because at that brief 1.2 seconds of time it is no one's property. I am unclear on whether this pertains solely to landing inside or whether it becomes the property of the county and/or waste management companies after passing the event horizon of the receptacle lid however. That would probable be a thing for the lawyers though I suspect the legal argument would hinge on intent as the prior owner had communicated a property transference from themselves to the trash collectors that had been unlawfully intercepted in a similar manner to stealing a package from a delivery service, though it could be disputed since something being orally communicated does not hold the same legal weight and is typically unenforceable contractually in the same manner as written agreements. Regardless I'm pretty sure that in any case you could still be arrested for petty larceny at any stage between company to landfill of taking old food, trash, or anything else.

Actually I kind of wonder how this works legally with something on the curb, since by not being in a bin it is not the lawful property of the city or trash companies, and by being on a sidewalk is public property and thus officially no one's property in particular. This just makes me wonder the legal status of old TVs and furniture left for trash removal or free depending where it is on a property line.
No. 36884
>This just makes me wonder the legal status of old TVs and furniture left for trash removal or free depending where it is on a property line.

In Germany people just take it. Perhaps there do exist trials but it's common behavior that you search the stuff on the curb, waiting to be removed by the trash service of the city, to your liking and take whatever you want. People even drive around in vans and lookout for piles of bulk garbage. Because usually there are certain dates the trash services offers for that kind of removal.

>But oh God, that one woman with her "I'm afraid of bugs" and all these damned yuppies sleeping on a lawn. You know what especially makes this unrealistic? ...

I guess it's just a liberal middle class test ground to raise awareness a bit. So you sleep outside (experience) but it's on a property of people that are fine with it and that know about the experiment. The food search is the other experience maker, the women having to cancel it because her body built is not allowing for strolling thru heat without food tho... It was the moment the KC heritage sparks and I had to think of burger fatness. It was just too much of a classic memeworthy situation.
No. 37048
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Fugazi: Instrument

Instrument is a documentary film directed by Jem Cohen about the band Fugazi. Cohen's relationship with band member Ian MacKaye extends back to the 1970s when the two met in high school in Washington, D.C..[1] The film takes its title from the Fugazi song of the same name, from their 1993 album, In on the Kill Taker.


No. 37363
I know it risks at getting into political shitposting territory, but I found this ironically enough over hour long countryball documentary on the current geopolitical tidal and economic situation with China to be very illuminating
No. 37365 Kontra
I particularly wanted to share that because of the absolutely shameless asskissing the WHO just did to China
No. 37598
So I've been beginning to watch some documentaries on Communism, but first I'd like to ask for hopefully some response from the Slavs on here with my questions and comments regarding Communism and what happened to the Russian state and later Soviet Empire. I just started watching this one

After having watched
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIOXVx1wHws a british documentary on it and
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1OZYoxaJ2Y which addressed life under Communism specifically in Ost Germany.
No. 38203
Top notch doc about Iranian Shah's mega-party before he was booted.
No. 38252
Great video. Considering all of the contemporary media coverage this recieved, I can't believe I had never heard about it.
No. 38292
This is a totally unrelated thing from kurzgesasgt about automation but I came here just because of how butthurt that made me. Fewer people doing jobs, stagnant man hours, stagnating wages, highly educated work force stuck flipping burgers and not owning their own homes or raising families, all this leaves me the question:
What exactly was the deal with automation in Communism? Because as more of my hyper Capitalist society has been automated they're trying to blame all this on automation but somehow I don't think that's why we're poorer. In fact I think that on some fundamental level automation and freeing up of energy was the reason everybody skyrocketed from late 19th century standards of living to modern ones and that that's been falsely attributed to Capitalism. I'm starting to get this weird suspicion that if anything increased living standards happened in spite of, not because of, Capitalism, and that the system has finally found a way to sponge off workers and consumers to such a level that everybody is getting put in cages while working for a couple Jeff Bezos in the world who themselves don't really end up working.

Am I wrong? It's almost like automation just got turned into a new way for the elite class to sponge off the rest of society and have to give less out, in man hours, in bottoming wages, in nobody having benefits anymore, etc. I say this because Communism also increased the standard of living but had literal feudal societies to work with modernizing whereas the rest of us were already modernized and industrial.

Are my instincts wrong? I don't exactly understand what the deal is or is supposed to be in Communism with automation. If everything is automated under Communism then what's supposed to happen?
No. 39509
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Now that everyone has to be assburger by law I thought I'd share some mildly interesting documentaries.

>The Tulip Bubble

As you can imagine this documentary covers the tulip mania that gripped the Dutch Republic during the 17th Century. I liked the way it analysed the multitude of reasons why tulips became the first speculative bubble owing to biology and Dutch Calvinism.

I'm very fond of tulips. Womankind suffers because, even when I set out to buy roses, I cannot resist the allure of their sturdy petals and bell shape. Lovely/10 - would become a greedy tulip baron.

>Oak Tree: Nature's Greatest Survivor

This is a two part series that focuses on the wonders of oak with a special focus on a tree that dates back to the English Civil War. I especially liked learning about how the Trees root system has a mutually beneficial relationship with fungi that burrow into solid rock to extract phosphates.

>Tank on the Moon

Provides an overview of the Soviet Lunokhod Programme to put robotic rovers on the Moon during the 1960-70s. I especially liked learning of all the engineering that went into making these machines that would only see an American equivalent in the 1990s and occurred at a time when people knew nothing of the Moon's surface. [I assumed the name comes from the fact that they used a Leningrad tank factory to design the chassis]

I've been getting the most out of my Curiosity Stream subscription lately. The catalogue is limited and has many unwatchable documentaries but it's good for noise and only £20 for the year.
No. 39524
Automation increases productivity, which means you need less labor for the same level of output. In theoretical terms it is a pure benefit for society - you produce more with less.

In practical terms, it is very easy for the gains from automation to be funneled to only a few people at the top. Total productivity of the economy increases, meaning there is more money to go around, but there is no reason for the market to divert that productivity to the masses. Redundant workers are fired, instead of being paid more, or given fewer hours (and more free time) for the same pay. People get cheaper goods, but that tends not to offset the loss of income.

Mass disruptions due to labor productivity increases tend not to lead to unemployment, but rather shifts to less desirable employment. Farmers leave the countryside and move to the city to become factory wageslaves. Factory wageslaves lose their factory jobs and become Independent Contractors® for some app (and are paid even less than wageslaves).

This is why UBI will be necessary (though not sufficient). In the past, enough would be redistributed to the people in the form of wages and salaries to ensure a stable social equilibrium. But when humans are no longer worth hiring except for a small technical elite, this will no longer be the case, and the fruits of increased productivity will need to be forcibly redistributed to the ex-proletariat. There was a brief period in the 20th century where productivity gains led (generally) to greater welfare for all, when the grandson of peasants could get a well-paying factory job without any education or competition, and use the income from that job to support an entire family on his own. That period is gone, and the billions of dollars that are no longer going to the American people must be redirected back to their proper course.
No. 39919

I've held out on mentioning his content until now, but I feel the breath, depth, and consideration of multiple viewpoints is with enough earnest effort to warrant calling it an educational documentary. And is about as KC-tier of an documentary as one could imagine.

If only he was a tad more consistent in explicitly providing sources in the Youtube description rather than through other channels.
No. 43238
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Could be in the philosophy thread as well. Interesting for anybody who likes philosophy but is also interested in technology and science.


It has english subtitles.
>A philosopher without an image
>Gilbert Simondon (1924-1989), a French philosopher as mysterious as he is important, is one of those who, as the saying goes, "were wrong to be right too soon". A thinker of technology and future, he created concepts in the 1960s to tell our world. His language resonates with the most utopian of contemporary proposals for a new pact between nature and technology. Read in his time by only a few close friends, including Gilles Deleuze, it is now translated throughout the world.
>Like no one else, he appears alone, fragile, always on the verge of rupture, but also endearing and honest. From him, we have no image, but from his thought, there are "place-moments" which are the visible point of his philosophy. From Lecce to Brest, from CERN in Geneva to the prehistoric caves of the Mas d'Azil, from the Collège de France to the mills of Flanders, thinkers recount how their journey was transformed by their encounter with Simondon. Lives and theories come together to tell the singularity of an approach.
>A haunting question comes to mind: what are the reasons that could have so obscured such a masterful work whose relevance and humanity enlighten us today?

One interviewed person discribes him as autistic :DDD. Anyway, a nice little doc about the ontology of Gilbert Simondon and his thinking about technology and the realtion it has to humans.
No. 43239
This is something I've been realizing lately, namely that the welfare state is always going to be a feature in neoliberalism or most kinds of Capitalism frankly because it's ultimately not just less effort but also probably cheaper to do so rather than having to constantly put down rebellions and social strife by giving people parts of their money back to them. It is basically using public resources as bribery which largely strains the middle class but in such a way the middle class is bound to evaporate eventually thus leading to the collapse of that society anyway.

This realization came soon after I had the greater realization that all the prosperity talked about in the West is not in fact due to Capitalism like I had previously assumed, but rather in spite of Capitalism due to technical advances. It amazes me just how much Commie societies have managed to get their shit together after all kinds of society ruining events and circumstances. That it's own right isn't an endorsement of Communism mind you, but just pointing out the fact that had the Communists won the Cold War they'd probably still be living lives of plenty on some modern level while we all remained a bunch of impoverished third world shitholes in the wect.

Realistically speaking, poverty still existing at all is largely an artifact of the failures of this socio-economic system and points towards its general inferiority for a society because it is explicitly not designed to benefit society directly but rather that small globalist elite. Like what the hell kind of system uses quasi futuristic robots doing all our tasks while making people poorer and with access to fewer resources? Why the hell would we kick half of society onto the streets if we found a way to replace half their tasks? It's insanity. Why would the costs of production keep going down but the costs of everything else keep going up?

I suspect that a lot of this is built around expecting people to be too stupid or uninformed and adding enough steps to obscure the true nature of things. It's kinda like having society wide universal surveillance systems in place but convincing a bunch of morons to actually pay what little they're allowed to keep for the privilege of being spied on by Siri and Alexa, and doing things in such an obtuse way people don't notice or not letting them have access to that information while constantly pushing a bunch of issues like race, abortion, homosexuality etc to distract them.

Realistically speaking I've come to realize that the greater extent of my ease and luxury is fueled almost solely by technical advances. Keep in mind Americans work harder than rest of the developed world too by and large. On top of that we have more land than anyone else on the planet, including Canada and Russia because most of their land is useless tundra and permafrost, and yet we constantly have unoccupied buildings and unoccupied land and the housing prices are absurdly through the roof. Housing alone absorbs a ridiculous amount of all our budgets here. Food is cheap not because of Capitalism but because of the advances in things like fertilizer and machinery.

This is all partly just because of an interest in science fiction where it becomes rather easy to compare with cyberpunk dystopias and the recognition that we have the latter precisely because of the system model which is not flawed but rather working perfectly according to design, and that is because no one ever seems to question whether their assumptions of the end goal are what is flawed. I realized that early on in high school where it dawned on me that our school systems are not shitty because of a flaw in design, but rather that our collective assumptions of their purpose is wrong, namely that it is to be a factory for churning out obedient worker drones who mindlessly obey authority and are susceptible to advertising and other forms of propaganda and who are readily expended to die for Israel and corporations.
No. 43243 Kontra
>to die for Israel
No. 46464
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Oh dog that is so fuggen Russian
I didn't know about that. I literally had no clue either about them shooting something to the moon nor having done that, nor the fact that Khrushchev had presented Ike Eisenhow with a gift replica of the Russian moon object right after getting there. That is such distinctively Russian troll diplomacy.

Anyways here have this one hour long documentary about the fateful trip Khrushchev made to America for a couple weeks back in 1959 that I am watching right now. I akso think it's incrdibly hilarious that this guy visited a fucking IBM plant back in '59 and all he really seemed to care about were farmers and supermarkets and having cafeteria trays to pick out.
No. 46476
>It is basically using public resources as bribery
This is the wrong way to look at it.

In every healthy society, the group makes sure that even the worst off are taken care of to some basic level. If we consider small hunter-gatherer bands to be the evolutionary default of humanity, then this state can also be considered a natural one.

Capitalism is unnatural and inhuman. Regularized transfers of wealth from the rich to the poor are a necessary part of maintaining a healthy society that exists in harmony with human nature. This is why libertarianism bug me so much. The fundamental premise is illogical. Man is an obligatorily social creature - always has been, and always will be. Liberating man from binding social duties in the name of atomistic rights will ultimately destroy society... which naturally harms the individuals who exist as a part of that society.

The neocon project has always been full of literal Israel-firsters, and there is a good case to be made that American policy in the Middle East only makes sense in light of pursuing Israel's interests.

Considering how easily American politicians are bought, this shouldn't be surprising. I would only disagree with the theory outlined above insofar as the Gulf monarchies exercise influence on the same level as Israel (though Israel and the oil sheikhs have a lot of shared interests).

Why do we have such a hate boner for any organized Shia group in the Middle East? Why are we so obsessed with Iran and Assad in particular? Why do we shill for Israel at the UN every time they're condemned for basic violations of human rights and international law?

All our stupid bullshit makes perfect sense if you consider that America's actions have nothing to do with America's interests. As Jugurtha said of Rome, "a city for sale and doomed to quick destruction, if it should find a buyer."
No. 46486
If I forgot to mention the fucking Saudis and other sheiks I apologize. I also detest our support for monarchies like Qatar.
>insert americabear bff's
I actually literally switched parties partly over this back in like 2018, 2019. Trying to give nuclear tech to a defacto enemy nation we are in bed with, who use our oil money to fund and supply Jihadist movements over the world, and who practice quite possibly the shittiest form of Islam on earth--Wahhabism--is terrifying. Can you even fucking imagine those peoole getting their hands on dirty bomb material??? So the guy decided he not only wouldn't be better, but would suck dick harder than any other neocon we ever had.

There is a reason why genuine independent politicians like Sanders and Ron Paul get routinely shafted. I know there's a lingering Cold War and post-Cold War geopolitical element to it, but I cannot fathom the relationship being remotely good for us and it is the major part of why we went to Iraq again and tried to destroy Syria and Iran because of Saudis and the right wing Israeli governements of scumbags like Sharon and Netanyahu who himself btw is racked by political scandal and nationwide protests in Israel demanding his ouster.

I should clarify that I obviously don't support feeding Israel and her people to the wolves. What I do believe is supporting such piece of shit governments will make that too inevitable someday. This is also why it's not wise to support those two faced sons of bitches in the Knesset because in case anyone forget them selling our missile tech to China, Israel is out for Israel and they will sell us out to China in a heartbeat. These are two of the worst allies that we've ever had and it's partly because our cocksucker political establishment hates people and places like Venezuela and Libya so damn much they'd rather see them burned to ashes then make peace.

Regarding the Shia I've come to understand that Shiites are real mates. Not to blindly act like they are somehow good guys, but put it this way: Shia is the not as shit faction of Islam. Sunni Islamists are clearly garbage and are responsible for 99% of the problems. Shiites only a couple times did anything truly terroristic and malicious and it could arguably be said them doing things like bombing our barracks was an act of self defense in direct retaliation for our national policies as guided by Israel and KSA and while himself a bit of a shit I can't help but admire Ahmadinejad for his "9/11 was an inside job" speech at the UN which our and Israel's totally asshurt delegates walked out on, which was a fucking pathetic and childish display.

In a more perfect world quite frankly I'd pivot the United States towards national friendship with Venezeualans, Iranians, and hopefully Russians someday when their lesdership acts slightly less pidoristic, cut off funding from Israel until they get a reasonable government that I can deal with and a warning that if they start enough shit we will not help you so hopefully they unfuck themselves in the Knesset, and let KSA get fed to the fucking wolves.
>but muh bases
Well then let us be on friendlier terms with the Iranians, Egyptians, and others around strategic energy and shipping lanes, and let us use these new players to isolate CHYNA.

But we don't, and we won't, because all our politicians are bought and paid for by domestic and foreigner oligarchs who are driving our national policy and victimizing and antagonizing other countries who will rightly hate us and cheer on our destruction as a result.
P.s le electric car Mars guy is a toral fucking faggot just like all the rest of them
There are people in this country who deserve to have a bag of rocks tied around their necks and thrown into the ocean and we should give them a choice of the bag of rocks or lifetime service to others washing dishes
>we will coup whoever we want
No. 46527
>Regarding the Shia I've come to understand that Shiites are real mates

The big difference I think is that Sunnis have inherited the mentality that they're supposed to be on top of the world, while Shia have inherited the mentality of being an eternally persecuted minority. Both of these mentalities are enhanced, or produced where not present, by international media and preacher circuits.

So at "worst", Shia have a furious rage against the people who have (generally rightly) been seen as oppressing them. Whereas Sunnis are the most obnoxious entitled shitters on the planet. I've seen so many who love it whenever some infidel says anything positive about Islam, but who will never, ever, ever extend that same genuine respect and appreciation to someone else's culture.

It's the same kind of bad faith I would expect from Christians in the 17th century, who purge all the Jews and Muslims and heretics from their countries and then cry when the Japanese do the same to Christians.
No. 47444

Small report from France 24h about cajun people trying to resurrect french language in Lousiana. Interesting theme but honestly the report doesn't tell much.
No. 47493
This is the best african channel about african post-colonial history IMO. All vids are worth watching.
No. 47582
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I like Cuttlefish so damn much
It really does need to be made that a bunch of epistles be sent out banning eating behavior against intelligent and sociable animals like cuttlefish, octopus, monkeys, chimps and other simians, dogs etc and reempahsizing the ban on eating things like pork unless you have to to survive, in spite of how repellent certain porcine behavior may be. I find it ironical how fuck is that an english word I listen to Runglish too much here we had a good thing going and people did not understand certain dietary and moral restrictions, before the discovery of things like germ theory and the cross pollination of zoonotic illnesses. Clearly the Han are repellent in more ways than one, and their iniquity routinely blights this world with their immoral behavior. I am more convinced than ever the Great Dragon is in reference to China but do not know who "Michael and his angels" represents at the national level.
This is all an aside but briefly it should also be noted how much and to what degree astrology was commonplace as "science" back during the times of John the Revelator and fact that certain constellations could likewise be used in association with national animals. The field of astrology, as in ancient astronomy, not moronic horoscopes for middle age women, was a sort of symbolic language and study of the movement of the heavens necessary to understand the language of the ancients but I digress.

Truly this is a wonderful and fascinating animal and it horrifies me that some people eat it, likewise as with hunting and eating whales. I think that we do need a new religion, and one that refreshes certain misunderstandings about moral failings with revealed sciences like why it is an abomination to eat bats and monkeys, but we are still in a terrible and dark secular materialist age that only seeks to understand cause and effect of the physical. I find it interesting that many of them seek discredit the notion of animals being any more than biological machines, and hence unable to feel pain and "soulless" and the preachers of this doctrine are thus preachers of evil and falsehood, likewise to justify their own abominable experiments on animals in the Wect in equal measure of reprehensibleness in their tortures of rats, monkeys, cats, dogs, and so on, as those on the far Eact who eat them.

I'd really like to populate a planet with crabs and cuttlefish and plankton if we can discover a habitable world that doesn't have it's own biome yet, which likewise needs to be regulated as being free from earth contamination, and that rather than rely upon the malleable and easily erased doctrines of men and their fake laws that are ephemeral, be enshrined within religious doctrine which is nigh unbreakable. We simply need one to not be an open scam or similar faggotry as a Utah cult, as it is now.
No. 47584
I understand the feeling of alien kinship towards cephalopods, but remember that pretty much all of them are sociopathic cannibals as well. If an octopus will kill and eat other octopus without remorse, why should treat them any differently?

Likewise with hunting bears or mountain lions. I might viscerally dislike killing a beautiful totem of nature, but that's the only way that I can object. Bears and mountain lions and normal lions and tigers will all eat a deer or similar animal alive. I care about their preservation in the same way I care about the preservation of ancient Egyptian manuscripts, but that's it. You can't extend empathy to a being that is incapable of it.

But yes, killing an elephant or (most) whales should be considered as bad as murder. Not only are you killing an intelligent being, but you're committing sacrilege against the best of nature, which should make up for any doubt about the exact level of their intelligence.
No. 47586 Kontra
Also, we were just as bad as the Han 200 years ago. Americans and Europeans would go all over the world driving advanced mammalian life extinct just so that a few ocean hoboes could make a quick buck.

And don't forget how we (this includes plenty of American traders) saw that we could make a fortune by flooding China with an addictive illegal drug, and then did just that. Now (some) Chinese people are doing the exact same thing but in reverse, with even the same category of drug, but how can we pretend that they're fundamentally different to us? They're just in the same place as the West in the 19th century - with the technology to reach the entire world, and the pure profit-seeking mentality of a people just emerging from the perennial pre-industrial poverty of mankind.

Taiwan, and even the big tier 1 cities of the mainland, aren't so bad. You just happened to be born in the narrow slice of time where Chinese culture is at its absolute worst.
No. 47746
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Power of Grayskull:The Definitive History of He-Man and the Masters of the Universe
Beginning with a brief overview of the 1970's/early 80's toy market-where products were licensed from existing intellectual property- this documentary reveals the collaboration and decisions which gave birth to Mattel’s original creation(heavily influence by Conan, ofc). There is a lot of art showcased throughout, and the film does a good job of focusing on the individuals who contributed to the world of He-Man, rather than the corporation which employed them.
Since there was no established story for children to imitate, Mattel needed to create one: enter comic books and the iconic cartoon! A behind the scenes look at the animation process was especially interesting(rotoscoping-filming and tracing live actors- was used for a number of common scenes like laughing and running). After documenting He-Man’s rise to peak popularity in the late 80’s, as well as the associated cultural issues (Is it okay if He-Man uproots a tree? A She-Ra spin-off featuring legs!), a lot of time is devoted to the 1987 movie starring Dolph Lundgren, before wrapping up with the 2002 anime influenced reboot and current fandom.
While I'm only a casual fan of He-Man, I enjoyed this film for its entertaining stories and figures, as well as its unique glimpse into the corporate-creative process.

Power of Grayskull: The Definitive History of He-Man - Official Trailer
No. 47819
A lot of that is just whataboutism and what people now long dead did then does not excuse what they're doing now. Nor, quite frankly, does that justify or excuse the behavior of these kinds of absolute fucking subhumans
And then you wonder why I absolutely despise these fucking people too. Thank God I was born in the country, otherwise I might naively give people like in that video a pass as would be the liberal way "oh he's just being 'rustic'" "well not everyone..." "yeah but what about the Han" "you do realize it's a way of life right?"

I hope people like that fucking die. I'll give the Han this, because I've never personally known them I can only give them more of a general floating point of contempt than the kind of personalized hatred I reserve for other people. That's the kind of kid who deliberately swerves his truck to hit every snapper, painted turtle, woodchuck, beever, or whatever he sees, before one day he's driving drunk hopefully gets ejected head first and skids across the pavement so half his body is debrided.
I actually came home in a really good mood today, left out some candy on the off chance any kids come, and settled in for some youtube videos about bobcats and other wild animals, when of course skipping through related my pet bobcat videos this vile subhuman comes on and I'm just as angry and hateful as I normally amat least every single person acted genuinely decent and like an American should be if the rivers were raspberry syrup and the streets gold must be the holiday and people realizing whichever asshole we have for four to eight years we're still all fellow Americans for better or worse.
I mean fuck. I'm at least self aware enough to analyze that transition into being in a shit mood from good one rather than just be reactive.

But yeah I saw that video and it reminded me of your remark which I hadn't replied to before because it basically would've been just what I said up top.

I guess on the plus side at least bobcats are felines afterall, and felids are all a bunch of cunts anyway so it's basically dumb cunts eating other dumb cunts but still.
No. 47822
>A lot of that is just whataboutism
"Whataboutism" is almost always justified. The term is just a cynical way to defuse accusations of hypocrisy.

I get on your case about the Han because you talk about them like they're inherently rotten to the core. Mainland Chinese culture is complete shit, but there's groups of Han all over the world living in advanced cultures (including purely Han ones) that are no worse/much better than the average American. We just got a shitty timeline where retarded commie peasants delayed the economic and cultural development of mainland China by several decades. That doesn't make the present behavior of mainland Han any less shit, but it's not an innate thing about China or its people.

>waaah they killed a bobcat :(
It's a predator that is far more cruel to its prey than those humans were to it. Boohoo. Bobcats aren't anywhere close to being endangered, so there's no way to compare this to Chinese faggots driving tigers and rhinos to the brink of extinction for hoodoo dick pills.

>I guess on the plus side at least bobcats are felines afterall, and felids are all a bunch of cunts anyway so it's basically dumb cunts eating other dumb cunts but still.
My point exactly.
No. 48311 Kontra
No. 48659
New channel with only two videos so far, but both videos are great, really worth watching, the themes, the information and the quality are all great. Haven't seen anything good like this on YT in a long while
No. 48665
I wonder if you even see how you contradicted yourself, but considering you also somehow missed the subtext about Chinese eating cats and dogs I somehow doubt it. Might as well say oh boo hoo cats eat songbirds.
No. 48676
The problem with eating cats isn't that it's inhumane, it's that it's unsanitary. Eating animals that eat other animals results in bizarre diseases, whether they are natural predators or whether they're British cannibal cows.
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[Citations needed]
Also it's a problem of if it's cooked or not and how the meat is prepared. If you work with your bare hands with any meat it's exceedingly risky. It's also a problem of cooking the meat. Pic related is what you can get from improperly prepared pork. I'd like to see what diseases you think you're talking about.
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I am still amazed by the doge and while watching this formed an interesting sentence in my mind that really struck me for having thought it after having seen lots of (often Russian) videos of pet bears
>"I wonder if we can make bears part of us like dogs are"
Just the mapping of that sentence is kind of interesting to me for the fact that I know how widespread it is among our kind "one of *us like dogs are." That level of symbiotic relationship we have with them seems to have gotten to the point it transcends our simple mammalian instincts to "adopt" young hatchlings of all manner of species into the "family" and actually treating them as human infants, which stripped down is really just part of a genetic script running inside us which is as seemingly cold and dark as the universe and merely an odd expression of our species' survival instincts hard coded to care for our young (although it would likewise seem a bit odd that we're mainly the only species which does this widespread culturally and as a matter of habit across most societies as the rule whereas the few times it happens among other species seems to only be the noteworthy, rare, if not odd exception). It seems to me that we spent enough time coevolving with dogs that they may have partially changed our societies and it seems to have happened in different parts of the world, although you can probably find wide divergences culturally among peoples who had dogs, and ones that didn't.

It's just an interesting thing to reflect on right now, especially since we'll actually take the things to war with us and murder our own kind openly and systematically but still become furiously butthurt over a dead dog as if the warring tribe murdered one of our tribe's infants. I guess they also serve another purpose which isn't really consciously talked about that the documentary hadn't touched on, which is our use of dogs to pretty much detect "evil." Having a dog wildly increases your own chances of reproduction because it shows that you are both trustworthy as a human generally, and have the capacity for good parenthood specifically, which goes well beyond simply meeting a future human mate and questioning doing the equivalent of sniffing their rear ends as your pet doges do likewise with each other. Personally I find myself aware of how deeply I cannot ever trust another human who dislikes dogs. It's simply out of the question to me and I am willing to write off whole societies as an instinct because of it. Although I guess at the same time, anyone who displays aggression towards dogs, and mutilates or poisons them as a youth, likewise shows proofs that they're never going to be trustworthy among our own species and in ancient times probably should have their psychopath hedas caved in with a rock before they can go full serial killer. I likewise find myself realizing what a relief it is to see a shelter dog going to the WH.

I wonder then what would happen to the relationship between man and doge over another ten or twenty thousand years uninterrupted should we somehow managed to not trash the planet into our own extintion towards the end of the anthropocene extinction event. Just that concept is so strange and interesting to me "one of us like a dog" as if they were borderline the same species as us and officially our own pack members as much as they see us as their pack, and will act ferociously to any alien human or other animal willing to do us harm. Usually. Some breeds suck as guard dogs and don't realize the intruder isn't there to pet them.

It also makes me wonder if, given perhaps another ten or twenty thousand years, could we similarly do that same very thing to a multitude of other species, perhaps even going so far as to minorly uplift them, perhaps even among non-packmate species like bears, octopuses, jumping spiders, whatever, along with herd beasts like pigs and goats. On the off chance someone read all this before you ask "but those species are not smart enough or natively non-pack animals" we did try to do that with solitary hunters like cats, though they do remain often dumb as a doornail and even now ambivalent about us. Just interesting things to think about, considering the great Belyayev and his succesors managed to mostly do it within decades through carefully conscious, deliberate, and systemic process so it would be interesting to see just how many species we could manage to domesticate and effectively make into "our own" within a couple of centuries had we the will to do it.
No. 49181
Great short doco on American family values in the state of West Virginia.

No. 49191 Kontra
You got me! This is really sad. One of them can't even talk...
No. 49196
>we did try to do that with solitary hunters like cats, though they do remain often dumb as a doornail and even now ambivalent about us
Cats do have some hero in their DNA, maybe we just need another 10,000 years to bring it to the surface.

Tara the cat saves 4 year old boy from dog attack

The Cat Protects Little Boy from Dog Attacking Him
No. 49222
Jokes aside its a fascinating channel to me.
No. 50312
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Currently watching "Leaving Neverland" and shits really fucked.

That whole "Did he fuck children or did he not?" question will never be answered, but hearing some guys talk about how Michael Jackson allededly sucked their dicks feels kinda weird anyway.
No. 50335
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I don't believe Michael could do anything like that.
He was about love and kindness.
They're all just gold diggers out for easy money.
No. 50347
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I don't know, he seemed to be a loose cannon to me after the skin whitening surgeries and the balcony baby debacle. Hopefully there is an alternate timeline where he stayed pure and become a black nationalist.
No. 50355
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He sure was a creepy weirdo in his last one or two decades, but for every person who says he was a child molester there seem to be 10 who said they used to be super close to him as a child and he never even tried to do anything bad.
No. 50364 Kontra
Wasn't all of this debunked already and the director sued for libel or something?
No. 50384
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Macaulay Culkin said that Michael never touched him, and he has no reason to lie about this
No. 51870
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Can't Get You Out of My Head (2021) - Part 1: Bloodshed on Wolf Mountain

Can't Get You Out of My Head (2021) - Part 2: Shooting and F**king are the Same Thing

Can't Get You Out of My Head (2021) - Part 3: Money Changes Everything
No. 51872
Interesting, the description reads like every other Curtis documentary and even though he touches upon many subjects discussed in academia, I take his documentaries with a distance, since there is debate in how he strings all the subjects together, yet I like to watch it, because a) it's aesthetically pleasant and b) he touches upon subjects you rarely see in documentaries, and especially subjects that interest me like cybernetics, technocracy, neoliberalism, individualism/collective,social science, techno science and so on.

I wanted to watch 1980s Richard Feynmann explain physics to the BBC audience tonight but after that there is Curtis on the list of evening entertainment.
No. 51877
Thanks, looking very much forward to it.
No. 51899
I was bored by the first episode and did not finish, maybe another day I will start again. What is he on about, really? It's kind of frustrating and the suggestive tone does not make it better, given that after 30min it is not clear what it is we find ourselves in right now. I want to say that Curtis is concerned with what people like Deleuze termed societies of control. But Curtis, as I know from an interview, is also very much interested in the individual as idea, dunno how that relates to the deleuzian thought, as I don't know what role the individual plays in Curtis works.
No. 51900
Adam Curtis always leaves me with a huge question mark in an ever expanding emptiness. Both his content and presentation style is wolrd view trashing. Although I agree with you that he isn't the final answer.

My fav bit this time is when Kerry Thornley starts to believe his own findfuck cosnpiracy. I was drawn to discordianism as a teenager but saw it only as a fun thing. I think I will give it another try and research it a bit more seriously.

Speaking of synchronicity, is this the Feynmann lecture you referred to?
Beacause I had a tab open with it when I discovered the new Adam Curtis and decided to watch Feynmann later.
No. 51903
>Beacause I had a tab open with it when I discovered the new Adam Curtis and decided to watch Feynmann later.

The Ernst-Hivemind.
Yeah, it is the Feynman lecture I meant. Regarding Curtis, I will have to watch it some day, when I can swamp more than I can now. I remember one of the earlier documentaries about planning in the USSR and Africa, I think it was Ghana and that postcolonial dam project. This whole doc I memorize as a history of planning and its problematics. Perhaps there was more to it. But that planning paradigm can be encountered in other documentaries of his. I wonder if Curtis tries to weave toegther a history of ideas and its consequences, like mangerial techniques like planning, the birth of the individual, subconscious trickery/programing etc. abstract money and consequently economic theories, all that, weaved together. Curtis is great as diving board for further research because what he seems to tackle is quite immense and probably not a work for just a handful of people let alone one who some tries to synthesize, not sure how successful, I think critique is rather easy to apply. He touches on interesting stuff but it's like "yeah, but that is not the whole story and you can probably refine and deepen it much more". His analysis is quite authoritarive in tone, he puts forward a thesis, strings (literally) together piece and then you think it is true what he said, but I have the suspicion that some arguments are more lose than as tight as they might appear. I remember some documentaries of him being more stringent then others, the new one seemed quite lose for the first 30min which frustrated me and I said too myself I will come back at it later.
No. 52200
Just finished watching All Watched Over by Machines of Loving Grace a BBC television documentary series by Adam Curtis.

Curtis argues that machines, mostly in form of the computer, have rather taken control over us and the way we perceive things instead of liberating us. And asks if accepting ideas like humans are computers controlled by their genes we also have accepted a fatalistic worldview that sees humans as helpless and unable to improve and change the world to the better.

No. 52223
I think I neevr watched it but does he mention Norbert Wiener and "communication and control in animal and machine"? Cybernetics spawned an influential epistemology that is tied to control, I often talked about this here, it's a super influencial paradigm that still haunts us today as dispersion of cybernetics. HMU if anybody wants literature, there is lots and lots.
No. 52225
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I quote lengthy from an article that is a general summery of cybernetics as control theory

Cybernetics’ Control Revolution

Even if Deleuze’s “Postscript” is about himself, he carefully avoided self-flagellation. He confessed nothing. Rather, he produced his own double. The latter stepping outside himself, getting rid of the former. But what would Deleuze have to get rid of? My pro-posal: cybernetics.
Control became synonymous with cybernetics in the mid-century. Cyberneticians with a penchant for building systems tried to make cybernetics into one great meta-discipline, much like philosophy’s previous status as the queen of the sciences. But aca-demics in general remained too entrenched in hyper-specialization to adopt the moni-ker, even as they absorbed its methods of systems-analysis and behaviorism that came to redefine the fields of mathematics, engineering, biology, computer science, psycholo-gy, ecology, sociology, design, and business management (Kline 2015). Cybernetics found more favor in the strategic analyses of post-war military think tanks like RAND or the counterculture. The latter was intrigued by Bateson’s idea of mental ecology, which took root in Stewart Brand’s Whole Earth Catalog and blossomed with the burgeoning cyberculture – later appearing in the hacker ethos that helped turn ARPANET into the world wide web, the ethos of technology incubators like Xerox PARC, the mantra behind its publications like Wired Magazine, and the interdisciplinary experimentation of its research outposts like MIT’s Media Lab (Turner 2006). The promise of the new digital world they were developing: “flatten organizations, globalize society, decentralize con-trol, and help harmonize people” (Negroponte 1995).
Cybernetics offers a window into a new aesthetic regime and general epistemology that emerged after World War II (Halpern 2014). Its aesthetic regime, a reconfiguration of vision as autonomous and networks observation as embodied in sensors and cameras,proliferating through information-based data-visualization typified by interfaces, all op-erationalizing feedback as a form of targeting and tracking. Its new form of reason, re-composing knowledge as communication by way of interactivity, environment, and pre-diction rather than ontology, materiality, or description, which led to the reframing of problems as perceptual and psychological, thus emotional and affective like the nervous system – setting them up to be resolved through population-level environmental actions of “users” trading in attention, energy, and anything else that can be made into units of credit.
Essential is the 1948 publication of MIT mathematician Norbert Wiener’s book Cy-bernetics: Or Control and Communication in the Animal and the Machine. In it, Wiener theorized that the age of the clock and the steam engine had been superseded by “the age of communication and control” (1963: 30).3 The paradigmatic device of control, fire-control artillery, unified a computer, director, and radar to target, track, and hit unpre-dictable moving objects like airplanes. The fire-control apparatus, for Wiener, expressed “the essential unity of the set of problems centering about communication, control, and statistical mechanics” that he thought capable of governing all human, machine, or ani-mal behavior (1963: 11). The military origins of the technology persist in how move-ment is taken to be a problem. So when the problems shifted to seemingly innocuous domains, the war-time anxiety over external threats persisted. Namely, that external stimuli are a threat to homeostasis, so they must be forecast, followed, and neutralized. This problematic formed a clear correspondence with the Keynesian planning state, which worked to counter the whims of the market through countercycle fiscal policies to guarantee full employment and price stability (Bernes 2017: 100).
Wiener was not alone. A whole cadre gathered to found a new general science of the mind in New York at a series of ten conferences from 1946 to 1953. Convened by the Josiah Macy, Jr. Foundation, it gathered physicists, biologists, neuroscientists, mathema-ticians, and engineers, as well as social sciences and humanists like the anthropologists Gregory Bateson and Margaret Mead (Kline 2015: 1-4). There they circulated early reimaginations of feedback, information theory, entropy, semantics, homeostasis, self-regulation, teleology, complexity, neural networks, machine-learning, object-recogni-tion, and game-playing machines (Pias 2016).
Summarizing the Macy Conference’s first wave of cybernetics theory as “homeosta-sis,” Katherine Hayles has traced how it was succeeded by two more waves (Hayles 1999). The second wave, “reflexivity,” she defined by an interest in self-organizing auto-poietic systems, the recursive role of observation as part of a system, and the informa-tional closure that creates a structural coupling between a system and its medium/environment. The third wave, “virtuality,” she identified with the shift to open systems, in which the image of life moving through a series of meta-stable forms in an ongoing pro-cess of evolution overtake both static and reactive organisms – its subsequent concepts of emergent qualities, multi-dimensionality, nonlinearity, and irregularity helped consti-tute the fields of chaos theory, complexity theory, and dynamical systems theory (Figure 2). Together, the three waves culminated in the idea of a computational universe in which “the great cosmos itself is a vast computer and that we are the programs it runs” (Hayles 1999: 239). Those most intrigued by the idea of a computational universe were not indifferent to its social and political consequences; in fact, that is what drew many of them to it.
A “Control Revolution” has swept the world, proposed James Beniger in a political celebration of control disguised as a historical study (Beniger 1986). That revolution, “a complex of rapid changes in the technology and economic arrangements by which in-formation is collected, stored, processed, and communicated” allowed for “formal or programmed decisions” to operate at a society-wide scale (Beniger 1986: 426-27). Its precursor, he claimed, was a crisis in control triggered by the new speeds of the indus-trial revolution as “goods began to move faster than even the winds themselves” and “the processing of material flows threatened to exceed in both volume and speed the system’s capacity to contain them” (1986: 218). The series of crises he laid out began with transportation in the United States as seen in railroad accidents, later reverberated through distribution, production, and finally, marketing, climaxing in the 1880s (1986: 429). Emerging to resolve that crisis, Benigner argued, were innovations in telecommu-nication (telegraphy, postal reforms, telephony), organizational systems (routing slips, cost control, uniform accounting, factory timekeepers, specialized clerks), mass control (full-page newspaper advertising, trademark, print patents, corporate publicity, million-dollar advertising campaigns), and continuous-processing machinery – which together led to a “restoration” of political and economic administration representing “the Control Revolution” (1986: 432-33). But he also gave the revolution another name, “The Infor-mation Society,” whose force would only increase with microprocessing (1986: 435-36).
No. 52226

A true believer, Beniger not only took society but all of life to be an information pro-cessing system (1986: 32-34, 179-84, 106-18). He saw all physical systems as controlled through three dimensions: existence, experience, and evolution:
>Existence or being, the problem of maintaining organization – even in the absence of external change – counter to entropy
>Experience of behaving, the problem of adapting goal-directed processes to varia-tion and change in external conditions
>Evolution or becoming, the problem of reprogramming less successful goals and procedures while at the same time preserving more successful ones (1986: 65-68).

He thus equated control with programming, which is to say, any act of physical encoding (1986: 41). Once rid of “consciousness, planning, purpose, or any other anthropo-morphic qualities to aggregate levels,” Beniger wrote, programming was free to take over life, culture, bureaucracy, and technology, giving way to genetic, cultural, organiza-tion, and mechanical programming (1986: 39-42, 103, Table 32). The ultimate triumph of the control revolution: that Adam Smith’s invisible hand now reached deep inside all life, or at least that which can be rendered computable by decision (1986: 41, 49).4
In sum, cybernetics sought to replace metaphysics.5 Its political vision of control, no less utopian than Henri Saint-Simon’s industrialized dream of replacing the government of soul with the administration of things. Now finally possible with a new aesthetic re-gime of observation, interfaces, and targets, and a generalized epistemology of commu-nication and perception managed in the aggregate.
No. 52227
Yes, it does. Basically it calls the "all beings are just nodes in a network"- theorem a scientific fraud.
No. 52241
Those utterly random hyphens are not making my headache better. Lack of paragraphing doesn't help either. I'll finish reading this later but I do agree with the idea, iirc read here, that people are backporting ideas of computers and technology onto themselves in ways that are false, to make them more like computers than other way around. I have long railed against cybernetics and many aspects of technology in spite of being a borderline techno-fetishist myself specifically because I am opposed to the social control, and to the way the tech will fit in the economic, geopolitical, and social order. For example you will likely have an implant that it is illegal to modify your own part's firmware, effectively becoming property of the corporation.

It is a more totality of turning man into slave than has ever before been proposed, with each grafted part not adding to the organism, but rather losing more of yourself, both physically, legally, and spiritually, to the extent that due to neoliberalism and globalism aka international Capitalism, rather than freeing us it will enslave us, just as due to the nature of our society automation and robots will impoverish rather than enrich us. There is no way around this because it is the nature of our awful flawed system itself. Were it another system, having an entire underclass of automatons would provide a life of leisure and scholarly pursuit, freed energy, enhanced production, abundance for everybody, as certain Marxists once proposed, as did the Venus Project; but instead, because of Capitalism all it means is a cyberpunk dystopia with massively burgeoning underclass and unemoloyment and homelessness, itself a self created problem necessitating a vast expansion of the police state and authoritarian powers. They will need even more dystopian methods of control, from blanket surveillance, to brutality, to camps, to something right out of the game Syndicate

The problem is the nature of our system, and in turn cybernetics would do nothing but make Man himself more closely mirroring the mindless automatons, and being treated as such; indeed, you will become less than human in more ways than one. It is the natural progression from the idea that tinkering with what should be your own property becomes punishable as a crime, because it is not your property, until you yourself become the property as is all hardware installed to your body

It is the logical conclusion of legal precedence--there is no other plausible outcome. You will become effectively owned by the company, because the company will own at least the firmware of your cybernetics.

I have addressed this and some other issues in writing about all the problems inherent in the new Eidos games, and specifically why Deus Ex HR and MD unwittingly became extensions of Picus, and themselves almost an audacious tongue in cheek reference to its own state as a piece of ideological propaganda, diverting your attention away from systemic critique and boxed in within the framework Eidos' propaganda had imposed on you, namely, the ideas that cybernetics are "evolution"; that it's more like XMen mutations empowering you, while blatantly showing the corporate logo of Sarif boldly printed on all your corporate owned hardware now replacing your own parts; on depicting those skeptical of corporate patented cybernetics as being akin either to religious fanatics, racist bigots, or authoritarian fascists, who moreover are motivated by the shadowy global conspiracy to suppress, rather than promote, this technology; and to frame it all, the entire problem of class, as merely being about insufficient access to consumer goods. It is in that very real regard a savvy establishmentarian propaganda piece, carefully constructed to portray itself as legitimate resistance to shadowy cabals, while itself directly promoting the interests of those cabals in the real world.

There is a certain extent to which a majority of our media takes an inverted approach compared to the Soviet system, where nobody trusted the propaganda because they knew it was propaganda, but rather positions itself here as resistance, opposition, or counterculture--in fact the implication was embedded in your very post. They seem rather to take the approach of pushing their message and interests by posing as the legitimate resistance or counterculture, while formulating those very ideas in deeply establishment think tanks and organizations like DARPA and the RAND corporation; indeed, that very thing has long been insinuated to have been the origins of 60s counterculture, in an effort to capture, coop, and redirect the anticipated inevitable resistance and skepticism that would come from the public.

Indeed, any videogame treats corporatism as a foregone conclusion, not just in present reality, nor just projected into the future, but in all realities; this should not be surprising given that such business entities have nearly monopolized all such content creation. It is reminiscent of Soviet levels of propaganda and information control. The true extent of this dystopia is revealed upon any cursory examination of the content, like the outright lies of Call of Duty rewriting history to have the Highway of Death atrocity in Iraq rewritten to having been done by the Russians, to even Stardock and Amplitude depicting all empires as having the alleged inevitability of becoming corporate, even the ones using Communist motifs, to games like Imagine Earth and Invisible Inc.; all such realities are redepicted as corporate ones. This becomes an even more amusing anachronism in waiting given that it's ultimately Wectern corporate wishful thinking and denialism in the face of an ascendant pseudo-Communist China.

The aim of all this, of course, is always the same in our system because the system itself remains unchanged, namely financial exploitation and social control. To them such things as cybernetics are merely a more powerful tool to that end, and will ceaselessly promote the tools of mass enslavement as the means to our liberation and salvation. They have been doing so for decades now, while devising new ways of promoting it, just as groups like VeriChip failed to promote implanted RFID chips for something as trivial as buying a drink, as though the surveillance and tracking enabled by credit transactions were no longer enough. The obvious subtext of all this, of course, is they themselves view mass social upheaval, unrest, and revolutionary musings as an inevitability when people come face to face with what they are doing, which is precisely why they promote these tools of enslavement as consumer goods instead, be it Alexa, iPhones, built in always online XBOX webcams, RFID chips, or cybernetics.

None of this is to say the tech itself is bad in and of itself, but rather that the outcome is a foregone conclusion due to the nature of the system in which it propagates.
No. 52244
>random hyphens/ Lack of paragraphing

I c/p ofc, paragraphing is like the original, just no empty line inbetween them (but the orginal doesn't have them neither).

Cybernetics proposes solutions by treating things like systems, by treating things digital (discretization) which means as distinct countable data that allow for mathematical operation, computation. Therefore cybernetics is perfect as operative tool.
The 60s counterculture was driven by visions of non-hierachical (anti authoritarian spirit of '68) socities (Fred Turner, 2006), the grass root network seemed the perfect political counter to topdown planning (also communist!), Turner anecdotically puts a quote from Steward Brands diary as kid or teen where he articulates his red scare, propelled by US propaganda we can suppose. Which brings us to the sacred image of individuality with these people.
Dieter Mersch, a German scholar said there are two camps in cybernetics: cybernetics as control tool for stability (of a system) or as bearers of emergence, of novelity (creative camp, counter culture strand).
What is introduced by cybernetics is very interesting as it also deals with question of the real and the symbolic. To this day I'm fascinated by it's operative rigor that we can see and also by the question what is a system, do we know if it is a system or do these people just treat is as system (and somehow successfully), what does this mean in general for humans, how much "truth" is in cybernetics and where are the limits of it as epistemology and its operative execution?

The article I was quoting https://coilsoftheserpent.org/2020/07/deleuze-beyond-deleuze-thought-outside-cybernetics/ from is about Deleuzes short text "Postcript in Societies of control" where Deluze writes that the dividual, pretty much a datafied individual in a sense, what you pointed out by consumer gadgets etc collecting data is creating dividuals, I lately read an article in online advertisement and dividuality, quite interesting.

But in the end, and you pointed to that issue already, it's a question of politics and sociality which is not solely a question of technology and definitely not solved by technology. What might going on is a depolitization: technology as replacement for politics...technology will solve the problem. Evgeny Morozow termed that ideology solutionism.
No. 54625
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Herzog docu on various religious and superstitious practices in Russia, featuring many strange characters, probably the most normal one being a man who claims he is the reincarnation of Jesus (he actually gives a pretty convincing impression)

Hilarious disclaimer:
>Herzog, as he often does, embellished the story of the Lost City considerably, acknowledging his fabrications fully:
>"I wanted to get shots of pilgrims crawling around on the ice trying to catch a glimpse of the lost city, but as there were no pilgrims around I hired two drunks from the next town and put them on the ice. One of them has his face right on the ice and looks like he is in very deep meditation. The accountant’s truth: he was completely drunk and fell asleep, and we had to wake him at the end of the take."
No. 83633
Nice report about the Swiss Bank