/int/ – No shittings during wörktime
„There is no place like home“

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Hail Odin! by Christenklatscher666

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No. 68814 Systemkontra
64 kB, 457 × 887
Previous >>67995
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No. 68815
493 kB, 4096 × 1890
Only posters from countries marked red are allowed to post ITT.
Yellow countries -- after a thorough and sincere apology.
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No. 68818
24 kB, 760 × 487
303 kB, 747 × 844
In an addendum to last post, I think it's even possible by physiognomy alone to understand who is the man who wants to strap an AT grenade himself and charge a Russian tank column and who is the man who is delighted in things like Putin making references to God in his constitutional revision.
It's a shame about the later, he's a genuine intellectual but the Russian question seems to sap his intelligence and he is left with the IQ of a 4kanker poster. He really claimed once that the primary reason that the US and Russia are in conflict is because the western states can't understand that Russian is an autocratic democracy.

There is a trend of certain otherwise respectable intellectuals experiencing cerebral death when the topic is Russia. Applies to people on the left too.
>>
No. 68819 Kontra
>>68815
The people of Portugal applaud the denazification operation. Our NATO-occupied government is not representative of our collective will. Putin, please denazify Portugal and place me as the ruler of a pro-Russia regime.
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No. 68821 Kontra
231 kB, 2048 × 1362
>>68815
Hey, we said we wouldn't commit troops or materiel to the conflict. We won't even let NATO shipments pass through Hungary.
We didn't close our airspace either.
>>
No. 68822
>>68819
>Putin, please denazify Portugal and place me as the ruler of a pro-Russia regime.
How is that possible? You would be dead from the russian artillery by that time.
>>
No. 68823 Kontra
>>68818
>Applies to people on the left too.
At least in Germany it was just simple contrarianism. My enemy's enemy and so on, USA = bad therefore Russia = good.
It's interesting to read the comments in the biggest leftwing newspaper's website.
The amount of cope and cognitive dissonance is astounding.
Also, now they are starting to slide into the nazi angle, because Ukraine is such a safe haven for neonazis and more than 14/88s of the country are rightwing extremists, so if you think about it closely, Putin is actually kinda justified in his denazification special operation.
>>
No. 68825
>>68822
Hey, you're still alive. How are you? How is your family faring?
Do your troops really use civilian structures as shields?
>>
No. 68827
>>68825
>Hey, you're still alive. How are you? How is your family faring?
I'm good.
>Do your troops really use civilian structures as shields?
I'm not even gonna answer such retarded questions.
>>
No. 68829
>>68827
>I'm not even gonna answer such retarded questions.
Well, that's what the russian propaganda is saying, including stuff like "how do you know it was the russians who shelled $TOWN?".
Having someone who is actually on-site debunk or confirm that shit is way more effective than calling them names.
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No. 68830
>>
No. 68831
2,5 MB, 262 × 480, 0:46
>>68829
Instead of spending my time with trolls like you, I prefer just to post this video here. Hope some of you retards will be ashamed of trolling while russians are killing people.
>>
No. 68832
>>68829
Naxi zelenski personally gave out anti tank weapons and portsble artillery guns to ukrainian babushkas. They have been deploying them from commieblock balconies, attacking russian troops.
They are no longer civilians, but enemy combatants, and retaliatory bombings are justified.

War is hell. Ukr nazis and their jewish master will pay for these crimes.
>>
No. 68833
>>68822
Because we aren't Ukrainian. As soon as the first rusty BTR crawls across the border, I'd expect a mass surrender. The Russians won't even have time to commit warcrimes.
At least that's my pitch to any Kremlin strategists reading this. If I complete Russian B2, I'll start calling myself part of the native Russophone population and demand protection. Pleae don't think I'm a Russiashill :DD t. visited Ukraine twice since 2014

>>68823
One wonders how much prodding these Germans would need to start accepting rear guard actions against nazi saboteurs. Maybe they'd complain and squirm a little, but with enough spit they'd just bite the pillow and allow Babi Yar to be reopened to business.
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No. 68834
129 kB, 1385 × 720
Tried watching some Russian news but it's so tiresome with the terrible automatic translations. At least the pictures tell a story. Here we can see some Belarusian patriots listening to Lukashenko's inspiring words.

>>68827
Great to see you. Ukraine has exceeded all expectations. I hope the wect would finally intervene in some real way. Ignore the trolls here, their barking is worth nothing.
>>
No. 68835
>>68834
People keep saying this but I have to ask you, all you, before getting sweeped into an emotional wave, what do you really want to see and believe the outcome of such thing would be? Did you want to see US and NATO boots on the ground? What exactly did you think was going to happen if American soldiers are now directly fighting Russian soldiers? Are you sure you'd like for America and Russia to drag all of Europe into a major war with your own cities being bombed now?
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No. 68836
2,6 MB, 2560 × 1400
I would just like to point out how absolutely hilarious this video is in retrospect, what with ten years worth of context and hindsight.
https://ernstchan.xyz/int/src/1646400720-785-423.webm
Didn't ruble just drop to 100/$1?
>>
No. 68837
>>68835
That's not a very honest way of initiating serious discussions by dismissing me as emotional. I don't really care if it's NATO or EU or ANY European country. Say that Germany(never going to happen) would step in to enforce a no-fly zone over Ukraine, would that be such a disaster? It's not triggering any NATO mechanisms, right? That would act as a real peacekeeping mission in Ukraine.
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No. 68838
>>68837
I'm talking about all the people I see including even on Steam and IRL who are saying "where is America?! why no USA forces?!" I'm asking you all including even Ukrainians just what exactly you want me to do, because then you have to accept the conseuqences for such action.

Say for example we should enforce no-fly zones, then what? Russia shoots down some of our planes, we shoot down some of theirs, situation begins to escalate, mission creep begins. Where exactly do you want this to end? With us sinking each other's carriers? Tactical nukes? Military "advisors" and no more?

Always know from the start exactly the most you're willing to lose betting on one hand.
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No. 68839 Kontra
9 kB, 250 × 250
>>68838
>just what exactly you want me to do
Biden, is that you?
>>
No. 68840
>>68837
>It's not triggering any NATO mechanisms, right?
Yes, it is, because Germany is part of NATO and thus they would have officially entered the war and from then on everything goes.
>>
No. 68841
>>68839
He is the collective spirit of all americsns, manifested as a digital ghost that haunts EC.

Ernstadmin needs to call an Orthodox priest to bless EC servers with holy water.
>>
No. 68842
>>68838
I'm not asking you or your Steam friends to do anything. It's up to the politicians. As for the escalation part, sure, things can escalate. But it's a two way street. Russia can back out any time they want as the ball is on their court. Does Putin and his buddies want to see their country turn to ashes with the rest of the world? I hope not. You'd expect nation states to operate on some level of logic at least. If that's not the case, the nuclear holocaust is inevitable anyways maybe not today but tomorrow.
>>
No. 68844
>>68841
Hail Odin! by Christenklatscher666
God is not punishing you, he is merely allowing the natural consequences for your actions to happen by pulling His protection back.
I actually wasn't planning on being here and partly the amount of virulently Ameriphobic posts ensured I'd remain a gnat burrowing in the collective asses of mainly Germans for days. Just being here tbh is both nostalgic and reminds me why I started that campaign to retreat from IBs altogether years ago until EC itself became like a methadone crutch. I'll be gone after today, hopefully permanently inshallah.

>>68842
Yes, but I'm asking you to tell me directly, as if I were some grand poobah in the bureaucratic apparatus, what you would have us do. I'm asking anyone here asking for more Western involvement to tell me/the board directly as though you're telling the POTUS directly what to do with the expectation he will actually act on it, and not just idle shitposting and armchair generalism.

So in that regard, yes, you expect such logic falsely, because of course insulated rulers are irrational dickheads. See also: Putin invading Ukraine. That's not rational expectations and calculations. In fact I didn't even see evidence of Ukraine petitioning NATO or doing anything beyond it trying for many years to be admitted into EU, so I'm not even sure why Putin did it right now beyond a false expectation that Americans and the West wouldn't get involved after leaving Afghanistan. So would Putin us tactical nukes on some embedded military targets under the expectation the West wouldn't escalate or use retaliatory tactical nukes back? Yeah I could see it being possible too. I could also easily see him bringing up nukes solely because that was the moment he knew he fucked up, and said nukes out of weakness not bristling strength.
>>
No. 68845 Kontra
>>68834
>I hope the wect would finally intervene in some real way.
If you mean boots on the ground or a no-fly zone, then I hope not. Basically you're hoping for this to escalate into a world war if you want NATO to do something more.
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No. 68846
>>68844
>I'm asking anyone here asking for more Western involvement to tell me/the board directly as though you're telling the POTUS directly what to do with the expectation he will actually act on it, and not just idle shitposting and armchair generalism.
Invade Transnistria and topple their regime. Unironically.
>>
No. 68848 Kontra
>>68803

good joge, ofc your statements don't align with right-wing and libertarian speech/aims and pattern of thinking, sure. And now take your meds, maybe a glimpse of reality will come back then.
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No. 68849
>>68844
I sure hope the USA/NATO are not getting involved. But then I also have no clue about specific ramifications of certain actions, so my opinion on this is worth bugger all.

General sentiment though: De-escalation of this clusterfuck. Bruised egos are preferrable to glassed countries.
>>
No. 68853
>>68821
I bet Hungary will be rewarded with preferential treatment when Putin ensures the safety of the Rodina by bringing all of central Europe up to the Rhine under his control. I am kind of jelly, because our chancellors recent turn will ensure that Germans will be treated as badly as poles and balts.
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No. 68854
>>68849
Burgers and Japs already becoming war tourists
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWbMsUrOTfw
Which I guess is similar what happened in 2010s with Syria. Announcing a "gun drive" yeah that's pretty Amerigan.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dTa_cIj1b4o

I don't know what's going to happen when it truly becomes a bogged down hellhole but I can now imagine that instead of just toppling cities until Ukraine surrenders that enough nonstate actor, not sure the word for it but global support is going to pour in anyway regardless what govts say. The official stance of the US govt is do not go, no NATO support, you may have legal trouble etc. but that isn't stopping burgers from trying to find their way there and run guns and equipment into Ukraine.
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No. 68855
1,4 MB, 640 × 360, 0:21
>>68853
At this rate I'll be happy if the energy sector being exempt from the embargo is true.
That way we can still build Paks 2 and buy gas from Russia.
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No. 68856
>>68824
So older Australian MLs are basically Hoxhaists?

>>68826
>Not everything is about retarded false dichotomy of right/left you know? This is one reason why I try not to engage particularly Americans in politics. They don't tend to have nuanced views about anything and see things in solely black or white. Not saying you, just saying. Also my impression is that American leftists are entirely 99% unified in their hatred of Putin and detesting Russia, since they already hated the two to begin with. The sole probably 0.9% remaining are just antiwar activists more interested in complaining about first world problems, with a remaining 0.1% being deranged tankies operating under the delusions Putler will abolish Capitalism and reconstitute the USSR or some silly bullshit like that.

That post wasn't about left/right insomuch as it was about the fringe leftists who support Russia. To me, that was rather astonishing because, as you noted, the vast majority of westerners are claiming to support Ukraine out of opposition to Putin and modern Russia. It's rare to see leftists who support Russian advances into Ukraine, but moreover, it's even rarer to see those willing to risk life and limb to fight for Russia. Of course, as Coinsniffer noted, likely half of those foreign volunteers, if not more, will never see combat. Still...

The vast majority of American leftists who claim to oppose Putin and really, all people regardless of ideology or motives are just spectators. For them, this is a perverse sportsball where they can claim to engage in world-changing affairs and feel morally superior to be "on the right side". Most will just bloviate online and perhaps give some of their disposable income to charities here or there, but few will be willing to actually fight. For those claiming to want to go over to Ukraine and fight in some volunteer militia, I doubt even a sliver will actually see combat. For most, it's just a grift for online clout. It'll produce quite the spectacle online, though:
https://kiwifarms.net/threads/r-volunteersforukraine.113841/

>>68813
>The rest is typical radical far right chan retards and whatever astroturfing is being done there who are basically indistinguishable from far left "I hate everything about here, my country bad therefore others who hate my country good" non-logic. Or, by exactly the same retard logic, "I hate my media, so whatever media tells me is bad must be good." Which who cares because China could literally glass half of USA and media would say it's bad and tragic, and they'd get on chans saying how "really China is good, librul media [insert retarded blathering]" so you have those people too at the farthest fringes.

>Curious. Fascist figures here seem evenly split between defending Ukraine (a sovereign European state being attacked by neo-bolshevik asiatics) and backing Russia (backing Putin's national-authoritarian forces against liberal-woke west).

The far-right is, indeed, very divided on who to support. People associated with therightstuff.biz are very cautiously supportive of Russia, but only so much as they are opposed to NATO and Anglo-Jewish-American influence. They do not like Putin at all and see him as a Jewish puppet or at least influenced by Jewish oligarchs not too dissimilar to several former Presidents of ours, namely the last one. They also very vocally dislike Zelensky, not for the least of which involves him being Jewish:
https://nationaljusticeparty.com/2022/02/28/nato-and-western-media-are-dragging-ukrainian-civilians-into-a-meat-grinder/
https://therightstuff.biz/2022/02/20/ftn-479-cognitive-dissidents/

Others, namely those associated with what remains of IronMarch / Atomwaffen, are in support of Ukraine with James Mason going as far as to encourage young men to fly off and fight in the Azov Battalion:
https://www.hyphen-report.com/james-mason-tells-siegekidz-to-die-for-nato/

People posting on IBs anonymously are hardly coherent
>>
No. 68858
50 kB, 960 × 689
>>68846
> I've already visited this meme state, so no mercy for it! But please don't touch Abhazia and Northern Osetia yet.
BTW guy who said "everything is fine" is thinking about moving to Georgia (they have a big diaspora of Russian migrants, mostly IT-garchs and political refugees).
>>
No. 68859
>>68803
>>68848
So, I tried to do some initial research on those arguments, because disimissal based on ad hominem should be avoided.

>They made a Nazi terrorist organisation part of their national guard.

Splitting this claim in two parts:

1a) there exist nazi terror organisations

1b) those were made part of the national guard

For 1a) I will assume that it refers to the volunteer batallions. For this there is a huge amount of evidence actually. [1] is a good listing of sources (the list is in German but most of the sources are in English) and [2] is an interview with members of the Azov regiment, you can see insignias of the SS openly.

Regarding 1b) I assume it's referring to the Azov regiment, which is indeed part of the national guard[3].

>They feed criminals

Rather dubious disclaimer; I guess I fail to interpret this correctly because the literal meaning can't possibly a point of criticism. Criminals are simply persons that have been convicted for breaking criminal law and are usually in prison, where they are obviously given food.

>They actually draw fighting to neighborhoods by placing their artillery there, same with nuclear plants, they move their own military into these positions and force the Russians to attack them

I was not able to find credible sources for any of the claims here.
Admittedly, my research was hindered due to the fact that I can't review sources in languages other than German and English. And especially the last set of claims is difficult to search for. Me not finding sources is by no means equal to the absence of sources and even the absence of sources is not a proof that the claim is incorrect.

Does anyone else have more on this?

[1] https://www.bpb.de/276575/dokumentation-menschenrechtsverletzungen-der-freiwilligenbataillone/
[2] https://yewtu.be/watch?v=xugyiBkreGE
[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azov_Battalion
>>
No. 68860
>>68836
Huehuehue.
> Didn't ruble just drop to 100/$1?
Yes, +30% commission on converting currency.

Some more videos which didn't age well:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22KqV2ye6M0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wIiPAUkDDNk
(and I've already posted soviet TV: "USSR will overcome sanctions, they'll hurt Washington's allies more")

For linguistically handicapped:
First one is video from 2014 on why Putin should NOT invade Ukraine. Notice same voice and intonation of speaker as in your video.
Second one is Russian TV saying "dollar will crash any time soon" for 20 years.
>>
No. 68862
>>68856
Also this:
https://nationaljusticeparty.com/2022/02/24/national-justice-party-statement-on-the-crisis-in-ukraine/

The views and opinions expressed on National Justice Party solely reflect the individuals expressing them and should not necessarily be considered an endorsement of such statements. This post is merely made to better inform others on the opinions of prominent people in the Dissident Right / Fashosphere / what have you.
>>
No. 68864
>>68849
>de-escalation of this clusterfuck. >Bruised egos are preferrable to glassed countries.
Bruised ego means the bear in the woods will get Ukraine. And when he gets hungry next time, he might try elsewhere in Europe. Putin has taken upon his broad shoulders the historical duty of reuniting the Russian world. Read, for example,
https://web.archive.org/web/20220226224310/https://ria.ru/20220226/rossiya-1775162336.html

Now, we know that Ukraine is part of the Russian world and reunification is inevitable. But historically, Russia controlled much more of Europe than only Ukraine. With Ukraine, Russia has back its foundations and its basement, Akopov tells us. Good for Russia. But what if Russia decides it should get back its garage, its tool-shed, its garden pavillon and its outhouse?

Take a look at the map of the world in the 1980s. I think the parts commonly colored in red would be what Putin could happily die with. He might be OK with the Russian empire in the borders of 1905, but I don't think it would be enough. I believe a Russian-dominated Europe in the borders of the Warsaw Pact is what Putin sees as the natural order of things, the world as it should be, the world as it was when he was stationed in Dresden, "working with people", before the catastrophe happened.

>Ernst, get a grip of yourself. You think Putin is literally Hitler
No, not literally, only functionally.
>>
No. 68865
>>68858
Consider the following - Western spy agencies topple the SHERIFF mafia and allow for the locals to reorganize themselves. Perhaps rename the place as the Pridnestrovian Russian Republic. All of this will involve cutting relations with Moldova, but that is a small price to pay.
We send development funds to Pridnestrovie and turn it into a functional country. Gangpress it into joining NATO. Allow them to keep their house of soviets and victory cult, even allow them to build more monuments and memorials with EU money.
In 20 years, the so called Russian Federation will be the one hosting referendums to attempt to join the superior and glorious Pridestrovian Russian Republican.
ok, maybe it really is because I've already checked it off the visiting list :DD
>>
No. 68867
>>68827
Stay safe, I wish you the best of luck.
>>
No. 68868
>>68859
Read Ukraineball's posts right at the start of this thread.
>>
No. 68870
>>68864
What many don’t seem to understand is that the invasion is just one step in the checklist of returning “rightful” Russian clay. The plans have been out in the open at least since Putin’s speech in 2006. The longer wect sits idly and doesn’t intervene the more difficult it becomes. When Ukraine becomes an another puppet of Russia like Belarus the security situation in Europe is transformed. Putin doesn’t listen to anything else than force so helping Ukraine to defend itself is the best action right now.

It’s sad to see people falling for Russian rhetoric of WW3 and nuclear war over Ukraine, when that will be the end of Russia once and for all. It simply will not happen.
>>
No. 68871
>>68870
The point about MAD is that nonody wins.
Sure, in case of a nuclear war Russia will be no more, but so will large parts of Europe. And living in one of those parts, I really don't want to have any of that, nor does anybody else.
But maybe that is your plan, have everyone wipe out each other, claim the rubble and form the great paneuropean khanate of Fingolia.
>>
No. 68873
>>68868
I did, as I've read all other posts of this thread. I'm afraid I don't understand what you're trying to say.
>>
No. 68874 Kontra
>>68871
Indeed, MAD makes it pretty clear that it’s not going to get triggered by defending Ukraine, in Ukraine.
>>
No. 68875
>>68873
He was offended at the suggestion that ukrainian forces could draw the battle towards civilians.
>>
No. 68876
>>68856
This is kinda what I mean about these people being self destructively retarded. Like do any of these keyboard fools even realize that, by flying out to join Azov Battalion and openly fight as a neonazi, they will be actively justifying Russian aggression while being explicitly used as a propaganda piece? Really it just amazes me sometimes how absolutely fucking retarded some of these people are.
...don't want to engage...seemingly natural consequence of two american particles interacting, it's as you say like basically just shouting at which of two sports teams are owned by the exact same oligarch. You're not getting any medals and you're not getting paid, and it's the players getting injured while the same rich guys get richer. For me personally ...complete clownshow the whole right and left here and in Wect became is partly evidence of that, ...erased most because I not only reject red/blue dichotomy, do not only choose a third option, but reject that and choose a fourth option because I'm not here for politics and should be gone after today.

Of course none of this matters really because it isn't our affairs, and isn't something we've really got much right to have voice in regardless.

>>68868
Well which parts we can see and which parts our different media organizations report is one thing, which I think he also probably meant "feeding criminals" by it that Ukraine has offered amnesty for those incarcerated who choose to fight instead. Which to be perfectly frank, that's not necessarily a bad thing, and moreover the whole "gang of whores and thieves" issue is something literally dating back to Napoleon and long before him. Such thing is literally a fictional trope https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ArmyOfThievesAndWhores because it's actually based entirely on reality, which I don't necessarily see any problem with beyond the fact it may be harder to keep soldiers from doing what they're going to do anyway which is looting shit and killing people i.e. what War ultimately comes down to in both concept and practice. It's literally the suspension of all laws for either survival or killing and lootingliberating in merigan/russiaspeak.

>>68870
Whilst this part is completely true and I absolutely agree with you, that sometimes it takes force to remove filth, and that sometimes you've just got to be as aggressive, as violent, and as vicious as possible, it takes wisdom and self control not to do so wrongly and give in. Partly problem here being, that unlike various situations of the past we now have multiple nuclear armed states which has never happened before and precisely why Russia and America never went directly to war for over 70 years, fighting "brushfire" wars between pawns instead.

So the difficulty really becomes, how much do you wish to conduct this as a game of chicken with the other nuclear powers? Because it's not just us but also you guys and Russia, it includes EU/NATO states including France which is nuke armed, and including newly non-EU member Britain that is nuclear armed, and which could include pulling in other nuclear armed states. It's a dicey game which requires a great deal of finesse to basically outwit and outbluff each other without going full exchange megatonnage. It's doable, just chancey.

Need I remind you, those chances and "acceptable losses" actually do include places like Helsinki getting glassed, just because you are not in NATO and because maybe Russia thinks it can get away with it and make an example of someone after "small" payload airbursts got exchanged over each other's troop columns, so now it is up to NATO figuring out how to respond to that. So the condition naturally becomes are you sure you want to do this, and how far are you willing to go, because yes, it is becoming a stop the Nazis scenario, but under the conditions now we and the Nazis can get glassed and shroud the planet in nuclear winter. So, there is that.

But as to specifically your concerns yes you are correct, which the Russians also just demonstrated in Kazakhstan. Pretty much Putin has been testing the West for two decades now which includes his idiotic dick waving over Swedish airspace or NATO seas, just prodding and testing us like he did until it got hundreds of soldiers killed in Syria. Those who say the only way to deal with this is strength are exactly right, but not dumb brutal strength without thinking through consequences, for while Russia may want to reunify into some weird gangster imperium, there are costs at stopping and containing that. We shouldn't have let them take Georgia and Donbass, sure. Maybe. But how far are you willing to go? Do you want us to counterinvade Ukraine and push them back to 20km of Russian soil?
>>
No. 68879
223 kB, 600 × 500
Facts:
  • it's war, and the first victim of war is truth.
  • everybody doesn't tell the truth. Ukrainian and Russian mass-media are full of outright fakes (sometimes they even steal them from each other). Established Western mass-media widely use distortion, omission, emotional manipulation and occasional "soft" fakes (using actually unrelated backgrounds etc. - whatever they can do to decieve a person without explicitly lying).
  • everything may be not what it seems. Only self-evident verifiable facts should be taken as such. Interpretations of facts aren't facts.
  • even if a respected man writes "my friend from XXX wrote me that...", it equals rumors. He cannot vouch for his friend that the man has really witnessed everything he wrote.

My opinion:
  • The invasion was immoral and wasn't actually forced.
  • Ukraine was practically begging for it, though. It partially comes from stupid and short-sighted Ukrainian decisions. Not that Ukraine can be hold responsible for it, but still.
  • It's definitely more harmful than benificial for Russia, and hardly anything can change the tides now.
  • Ukraine will be the defeated party. The only question are conditions of peace.
  • Putin will most likely burn in Hell for that, even if he hadn't earned his place there by fuelling the flames of civil war in Donbass back in 2014.
  • Let's hope the sides can come to some agreement as soon as possible, because casualties among civilians are naturally piling up. Such agreement would be preferable for both Russia and Ukraine (NATO may be disappointed - it's in its interest to protect Ukraine until the last dead Ukrainian, effectively weakening Russia).
  • And no, shelling apartment districts isn't a war crime per se. I said that in 2014 to Russians and I say that now to Ukrainians. Only the lack of military necessity turns into a crime, but it must be proved. Otherwise protecting themselves naturally takes the priority over protecting civilians for military men. It's the sad reality of ground war.
>>
No. 68880 Kontra
>>68876
>Like do any of these keyboard fools even realize that, by flying out to join Azov Battalion and openly fight as a neonazi, they will be actively justifying Russian aggression while being explicitly used as a propaganda piece?

Let's also not forget you'd be painting a gigantic target that would effectively say, "I AM AN INTERNATIONAL CRIMINAL! ARREST/KILL ME ON SIGHT!" Flying over with the intention to do military actions and be part of an organization that kills people will get you branded not as a POW but as a criminal.

Yeah, it's pathetic and distressing, but ultimately, we have no vote on this. We are but two anons chewing the fat online.

All I want is a better world for White people everywhere free of Zionist rule. That's too much to ask :DDDDDDDD

Just disregard this and return to the discussion
>>
No. 68882
26 kB, 678 × 308
Gonna listen to "enemy voices" on radio like grandpas did with "Voice of America".

Btw Facebook blocked, Twitter blocked, controlled opposition (Echo of Moscow and Rain TV) closed. Law for 15 years of prison for "disinformation" approved.
>>
No. 68883
In amusing British news, the Stop the War coalition is now protesting against Britain supporting/supplying Ukraine.
>>
No. 68885
>>68882
For fakes targeting the Armed Forces, precisely those which had particularly severe consequences (I wonder what they could mean by that). Nuances are important.

Overall, however, the reality begins to look more and more Orwellian. I wonder what we are going to have soon after Putin dies. A fascist military junta? A civil war between fascists and communists?..
>>
No. 68886
300 kB, 1276 × 1276
>>68885
> when Putin dies
This can't happen, he's soviet android:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFjQ_sufqgc

"Future" and "Russia" in one sentence gave me chills even before war. There is a bingo for you to check out. It's just things which already happened in USSR and 90-s tbh, and I think we'll have something new but equally nasty.
>>
No. 68887
>>68879
>And no, shelling apartment districts isn't a war crime per se. I said that in 2014 to Russians and I say that now to Ukrainians. Only the lack of military necessity turns into a crime, but it must be proved.
I think that even if very single residential area that was indiscriminately shelled had Ukrainian militias, the greater question of why the war is being waged weighs heavily on how criminal Russia's actions are.
After all, if a genocide of Russophones was indeed going underway, then naturally these would all be acceptable collateral, and the blame for the deaths of civilians would be firmly in the hands of Generalfeldmarschall Zelensky.

Interesting that I haven't seen any of the Russian apologists talking about this genocide, the genocide that was supposedly the stated reason for the war. They'll talk about NATO's provocations generally, but I think they see the official reason for war as too much bullshit for anyone to believe.
>>
No. 68889
>>68876
No need to lecture me about Helsinki getting glassed. Anyone with half a brain understands that nuking a "non-aligned" state would be the last step of escalation before a global nuclear war. And if it comes to a MAD scenario I'm only interested whether it's NATO or Russia who nukes me first.

>>68879
True facts.

I'm no international lawyer but Russia is firing cluster munitions, MLRS barrages and dropping unguided bombs into population centers. Maybe can't be proven as a war crime but it really shows how little your military cares about inflicting civilian casualties. However, [INSERT A PROPAGANDA DISCLAIMER]...

>The invasion was immoral and wasn't actually forced.
What do you mean by not being forced?

>Ukraine was practically begging for it, though.
Can you expand on this?

>>68882
Someone must've fucked up real bad with a time machine and we're forever doomed to an insane alternative timeline.
>>
No. 68894
>>68887
>>After all, if a genocide of Russophones was indeed going underway
No, it wasn't really. (And, overall, the meaning of the word "genocide" seems to progressively depreciate in the context of Ukraine. First Golodomor, and now... that.)
>>he greater question of why the war is being waged weighs heavily on how criminal Russia's actions are
At that level "criminal" generally stops bearing any sense. Were NATO's bombings of Yugoslavia based on forged evidence criminal? And into Iraq?..
It's just that: immoral.

The most terrible thing is that it's practically a fratricidal war. Russians killing Ukrainians and the other way around, for Christ's sake!.. All being Russian speakers, virtually identical culturally. Back in the 90s a prospect of that looked like a perverted fantasy. Now it's our reality. Why God still tolerates us on the face of the Earth is beyond me.
>>
No. 68895
>>68879
>It's definitely more harmful than benificial for Russia, and hardly anything can change the tides now.
The west will suffer more, due to stupid decisions of our politicians. The German economy will not survive this. The economical system as it is only kept together by 'gifts' of cheap fiat-money from the government and is ready to collapse, anyway. What will happen in Germany in the coming months:

Current: astronomical prices for gas, oil, diesel
May: lack of electrical energy due to natural gas shortages, blackouts
June-July: massive increase of unemployment, due to electrical blackouts and energy cost. Think 20% unemployment by the start of August
Summer, autumn: Last decent harvest for years to come. Energy prices caused a lack of fertilizer and agro-chemicals, farmers have been cutting back on fertilizer for a year now, and more will not be available, since the biggest exporters are embargoed
Autumn: Starvation in Africa and the Arab world, Germany, being the gay cuckold-country that it is, will give away all its stock to feed the Sand-Niggers and the niggers.
Winter: inflation reaches 100% and more. Most inhabitants of Germany can not afford heating. The old and the weak freeze to death.
Spring: Civil war breaks out, it's clans of immigrants against the weak, underfunded remnants of the German police and the German military.
Summer: Widespread starvation, poverty and destruction.

In the summer of 2023, Germans will be ready to beg Russia to invade Germany.
>>
No. 68897
>>68889
>>and dropping unguided bombs into population centers
Modern aiming systems on attack aircrafts actually allow to drop free fall bombs with the accuracy comparable to that of precision munitions. Just for reference.
>>Maybe can't be proven as a war crime but it really shows how little your military cares about inflicting civilian casualties.
They use whatever tactical capabilities they have. I'm not about to judge them, not without the full info on any incident at least.
The one who has started that crap is another matter. He knew it would likely come to that, and he cannot seriously blame the Ukrainian forces just because they don't surrender (that's absurd).
>>What do you mean by not being forced?
There were no objective circumstances which would make it the lesser evil or the only possible course of action.

>>68895
>>The west will suffer more, due to stupid decisions of our politicians.
Germany, yes, probably. The West in general - no, not likely. Russia is more dependent on the EU than the other way around.
>>
No. 68899
>>68867
Thank you.
>>
No. 68900 Kontra
>>68859
I was talking generally about his postings, never visit /fefe/ but indeed it must be the same German there.

Also the thread as 53 postings I did not read one today. Can't be arsed anymore. Can somebody update me on anything important ITT :DDD could also be about new turns in the war
>>
No. 68902 Kontra
>>68897
>Modern aiming systems on attack aircrafts actually allow to drop free fall bombs with the accuracy comparable to that of precision munitions. Just for reference.
This is objectively false though. They can be dropped quite accurately but it's definitely not comparable, especially when operating near civilians. You can observe this for yourself if you go look at training footage of F-16s or F-18 dropping unguided bombs on training targets. Then contrast that to the accuracy of guided munitions. It's a whole different world. Unguided munitions by definition are dependent on the deployment and environmental parameters like any other simple ballistic object.
>>
No. 68903
139 kB, 1071 × 715
113 kB, 769 × 1280
>>68894
>The most terrible thing is that it's practically a fratricidal war.
Are you saying this special military operation would be more palatable if it could be viewed through a racial war angle? berhaps :DD
The screws have all been tightened on dissent, such a situation would unthinkable and impossible to be carried out in any period. Russian society couldn't be convinced to kill Ukrainians for Yeltsin. Even in 2014, it was different.
But now... The threat of Kiev being given a complete makeover is there.

>At that level "criminal" generally stops bearing any sense. Were NATO's bombings of Yugoslavia based on forged evidence criminal? And into Iraq?..
>It's just that: immoral.
No, criminal has a meaning. A lot of immoral things aren't criminal. But what about NATO did they lynch Serbiansбратья((( and in far worse cases than the NATO intervention during the collapse of Yugoslavia. For the track record, it wasn't even that bad. And should some Americans be considered guilty of behaving in a criminal fashion? Yes. It's not simply a blanket case of 'immorality', with no distinct in between. When the state in all of its military might is used for such personal reasons and unleashes so much terror and destruction for petty presidential reasons.
Differentiating between different degrees of criminality is important. The Portuguese government is rife with immorality and criminality, our prime minister could just as equally be blamed of being a liar as your President. He has repeatedly, knowingly, lied about past statements in attempt to maintain his hold on power. To different degrees though. He didn't claim genocide and invade a country over it. He may have harmed our democratic institutions with his bullshittery, but nobody died because of it. Nobody suffered through existential horrors over his claims about his past mandate. I'd wish my vozhd' had lost the elections, but he was vindicated by popular support. I don't think his head should be cut off for committing such crimes.
>>
No. 68904 Kontra
144 kB, 357 × 321
>>68903
> pic
He bought? Invade Ukraine.
>>
No. 68905
874 kB, 1302 × 1080
>>
No. 68906
>>68903
>Russian society couldn't be convinced to kill Ukrainians for Yeltsin. Even in 2014, it was different.
Yeltsin was viewed as a drunkard and a Western puppet who had destroyed Russia. Putin is seen as the strong man who ended the chaos of the 1990s and is now bringing Russia back to the place in this world it deserves.
>>
No. 68907 Kontra
>>68906
I don't think it's just a matter of image. Development of structures that weren't present in Yeltsin's time. Societal conditioning that wasn't yet cultivated. Even Putin as a strong man who makes Russia great again is probably an outdated view of how he is seen by the people. I don't think Russians are happy with these developments, there does not seem to be the levels of fanfare and public support mobilization seen in Crimea. The bolts of autocracy have been tightened, if 'invade the Ukraine and shell their cities' went on a referendum, it would be a landslide loss.
>>
No. 68908 Kontra
>>68907
Personally as I see it, a few bureaucrats made a decision in Washington and then the Orthodox wizards, shamans and Eurasianists bureaucrats in the Kremlin decided to counter that move with this.
It wasn't something they "wanted", they "had" to do it because geopolitics dictated it. That's why there's no "fanfare".
>>
No. 68909 Kontra
>>68880
Do you actually even deal with nonwhites though? General rule for me has been and as evidenced by this thread, around whites expect fights. I'd rather not deal with more angry retarded old white people at this point. Also Jews are white. Don't care how much it butthurts both of you but it's true.
>>
No. 68911
>>68907
There's a decent chance that Putin will be retired before the year is over, peacefully by his own military or less peacefully by an uprising. Referendums in Russia are voted on with guns.
>>
No. 68912 Kontra
>>68908
>they "had" to do it because geopolitics dictated it
They didn't have to do this.
>>
No. 68913 Kontra
>>
No. 68914
>>68906
Putin is now bringing Russia back to the place in this world it deserves.
1990s Russia?
>>
No. 68920
441 kB, 22 pages
>>68879
My only quibble is that I disagree that the majority of the governments of existing NATO members were really gunning for the Ukraine in particular to join or are looking for an excuse to involve themselves directly in the current Ukrainian conflict. It's more that, as you put it, "Ukraine was practically begging for it" by the Zelenskyy administration pushing for membership even more so than the Poroshenko administration, which under current terms they would be able to attain unless an existing NATO member started loading bullshit requirements on them for membership.
Keep in mind I do think NATO enlargement has been a recipe for disaster like this, as have others for decades (see attached article). But that has more to do with NATO being an open-door alliance by default, encouraging states like the Baltics to latch onto it as not only an external guarantee of sovereignty but also a carte blanche to give Russia the stink eye in interests and diplomacy. I think NATO should become more restrictive in new members, if not perform a freeze of membership application outright (Georgia is even more of a fetch than Ukraine).

I otherwise agree with you points.
>>
No. 68922
>>68920
So you're saying we should restrict access to a defensive pact, because some countries should be afraid of and available for an invasion by an aggressor? I thought Chamberlain appeasement strategy fell out of style.
>>
No. 68923
>>68914
>>1990s Russia?
Or worse.
At the moment the avalanche of private sanctions from Western companies has the worst effect. Friends report that the IT industry is already crumbling, programmers apparently seek to leave Russia en masse.

I wonder how long it will be before any meaningful Internet connections between Russia and the West are lost due to the war of indiscriminate blockings (they're already banning Russian social networks in many states of the US). I'm starting to get a reflectory urge to kill, and it's not about the bastard we have in the presidential seat.

Starting to learn Chinese.
>>
No. 68924
Great Lent is starting less than in two days. I wonder if it will actually end this time, though.
>>
No. 68928
Today Selenskij will give a speech to the US senate. I wonder if it will amount to anything.
>>
No. 68930
>>68922
Fair take depending on what you view the function of NATO to be in regards to geographics rather than direct mission statement.
I've always found it extremely odd that Turkey was given full NATO membership beyond the obvious reason of military and strategic importance.
>>
No. 68931
16 kB, 276 × 206
17 kB, 290 × 213
14 kB, 285 × 212
>>68923
>Seek to leave Russia in mass
They better don't come to europe, because in autumn, it's going to be starvation here. Europe cannot import or produce fertilizer or grain. Prices have tripled since last year. Heating oil is 1.6€ per liter, up from 0.6€ per liter, people are going to freeze.

Europe is getting hit much harder than Russia, but Europeans do not grasp it yet. They are too soft, weak and dumb and too far removed from the realities of food production. They are going to learn the hard way. It's going to be so much fun to watch! All the whining and crying by the do-gooder leftists who can't get their tofu!

>B-but Germany is a rich country!
>The state must step in!
Gonna laugh my ass off!
>>
No. 68932
>>68911
>There's a good chance Putin is going to be retired
No. That's one of the comforting propaganda-bytes the media keeps pushing to calm tube population, but it's not true. It's
>Putin has cancer and he will die soon
-tier wishful thinking.

Putin is going out when he does of natural causes, but that won't be for a very long time.
>>
No. 68933
>>68930
>I've always found it extremely odd that Turkey was given full NATO membership beyond the obvious reason of military and strategic importance.
It was the sole reason, friend.
>>
No. 68934 Kontra
3,6 MB, 500 × 400, 0:19
>>
No. 68936
2,9 MB, 270 × 480, 1:12
>>68923
>they're already banning Russian social networks in many states of the US
I'd be more worried about your own state blocking access to all wectern media and services, or does it hurt you when Alabama blocks VK?

Anyway here's something that might be useful for you:
https://www.bbc.com/mediacentre/articles/2022/advice-on-accessing-bbc-news

As you might not be able to access that anymore here's the TLDR: Install TOR and for your daily wectern propaganda needs go to https://www.bbcnewsd73hkzno2ini43t4gblxvycyac5aw4gnv7t2rccijh7745uqd.onion/
>>
No. 68938
https://www.northernminer.com/news/russia-ukraine-tension-may-give-rise-to-a-new-commodity-world-order/

can somebody make a picture of this or tell me how to get around the paywall? I accidently clicked a picture while reading and now my free read is gone.
>>
No. 68939
>>68936
>That video
Based Russians ignore enemy propaganda and don't talk to the agitators. They know that Putin will increase the power and respect for Russia. They trust their leadership. Unlike in the west, where each magot believes to be entitled to his opinion and people fall for fake news.

I hope Russia will invade soon. It has been foreseen by seers in visions. Russia will invade the west. There is going to be an independent Bavaria with a king.
>>
No. 68940
>>68936
Orks sniffed the smell of blood! LOK'TAR OGAR!!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2o5KR1NhVd4
>>
No. 68941 Kontra
>>68934
I'm not sure if it was intended but I genuinely love this video. Got a dumb smile on my face.
Thanks for posting.
>>
No. 68942 Kontra
82 kB, 672 × 671
>>68941
>If it was intended
I guess whoever made it intended to make some people smile. In general, if you are in the habit of using insults like cuck, NPC and soyboy, it is going to make you smile.
>>
No. 68943 Kontra
>>68942
If western right-wingers are so wrong about Ukraine and Russia, maybe they were wrong about vaccines and other things too?

t. used to sympathize them
>>
No. 68944 Kontra
>>68942
Posting pictures like this should be a bannable offense.
>>
No. 68946
1,7 MB, 900 × 5142
>>68938
>how to get around the paywall?
Disable JavaScript.
>>
No. 68947
>>68943
>Are so wrong about Putin and Ukraine
Are they wrong, though?

1.) They say Russia is going to win this. I think they are right. Ukraine army can't hold forever. Russian objectives might be reached with a delay, but it seems like they are still getting reached. Russian losses are not prohibitive, either. Russia can suffer economic hardship much easier than Europe. Russians can't get Ikea furniture. Europeans can't get fuel and energy. Russians can plant potatoes in grandpa's garden in the village or at dacha. They can still fuel their cars to get there. Most Germans have nothing but their rented apartments and don't know how to plant anything. At least Russia is going to get Ukraine. Europe's economy might go belly-up before that happens or after it happens.

2.) Right wingers also say the west is to blame. Imagine EU and NATO had declared they would not admit Ukraine, in 2014. There would be no war in Ukraine. But maybe an emboldened Russia would have gone for Finland or the Baltics instead.

Concerning vaccines: the day when I am going to die of immune deficiency or cancer keeps getting delayed and I suspect the vaccine will not kill me, after all. Can't say anything about fertility for know.

To be quite honest, I think the people you think of are mostly nutters led by narcissists.

I personally met German right wing talk-radio host Ken Jebsen when he was still a local radio DJ in the 1990s. Back then, he still used the name his mother gave to him, which is Keyvan. He was very well dressed, very well coifed, very friendly and boastful with money. He also worked very, very hard to be seen as someone known and liked by everyone, someone smart, someone influential, someone important. And he has a way with people, very charming. But he didn't manage to become famous for another 1.5 decades, when he claimed Kissinger had suggested gassing Russian Jews.

The people who listen to him are ready to believe anything, as long as it's the opposite of the mainstream. For example, they believe wind turbines make people sick with infra-sound. (But not roads, roads are fine.) They believe vaccines are harmful, period, not just the COVID vaccines, also vaccines that have been out for decades. They believe electric vehicles are very harmful to the environment, because those vehicles use lithium and cobalt, and mining that is much worse than fracking for oil and gas, which should be obvious to anyone. They believe climate change is a psy-op and if it exists, it is not man-made. They put gem stones into their water, because tap water and bottled water is dead and lost it's micro-cristalline structure, and the gem-stones are going to re-energize it. They put magnets on their little owies and think the magnets will heal them. They are fierce believers in homeopathy.

And yes, I know people who believe all of this, and they will defend their stance, citing publications from German right-wing nutjob publishing house 'Kopp-Verlag'. You do not want to be in the same boat.
>>
No. 68948
>>68947
Truly evil people are very rare, most of the people who do bad things are just ignorant. What the project of the enlightenment really is about, is fighting stupidity on all levels, one century at a time.
>>
No. 68949
>>68936
>>I'd be more worried about your own state blocking access to all wectern media and services, or does it hurt you when Alabama blocks VK?
It only creates the appearance that Alabama is no better than Russia. And then for the average Russian the choice becomes quite obvious.
Really, with these sanctions Putin's rating will soon skyrocket without him doing really anything - appearance of an actually threatening enemy (and the Western countries are practically crying now "we're enemies of you all") is more than sufficient to trigger the natural instincts of gathering around the pack's leader.
>>
No. 68950
>>68947
>They say Russia is going to win this.

So does western intelligence.

>Russia can suffer economic hardship much easier than Europe. Russians can't get Ikea furniture. Europeans can't get fuel and energy. Russians can plant potatoes in grandpa's garden in the village or at dacha. They can still fuel their cars to get there. Most Germans have nothing but their rented apartments and don't know how to plant anything. At least Russia is going to get Ukraine. Europe's economy might go belly-up before that happens or after it happens.

Russians might miss other things that are crucial, I'd be careful with a complex system od dependencies. Right now not only Europe will suffer, but mainly non-EU countries.

>Ukraine and Russia are major exporters of wheat, corn and oilseeds—staple food goods which are now at risk. Globally, these two countries export 26 percent of global wheat and 67 percent of sunflower seed, cottonseed and safflower oil, according to the International Trade Centre. These are vitamin-rich crops critical to daily nutrition that are used in everything from bread, cooking oil and livestock feed. Both countries are essential food suppliers for low- and middle-income countries in which tens of millions of people are already food insecure. Importing countries in the region are already seeing price surges—a trend that's expected to continue rippling out into neighboring regions.
>In the U.S., costs such as processing, packaging and marketing remain relatively stable, and consumers could possibly see a few cents added on to supermarket prices. But regions more closely tied into Ukraine and Russia's agricultural economy will see marked differences in costs.
>Even before the Russian invasion, food prices were already climbing to their highest level since 2011. Now, inflation, supply chain disruptions and growing inequity worldwide, coupled with the conflict, has created the perfect storm for a global food security crisis, impacting those living in poverty the most.

https://www.newsweek.com/war-ukraine-global-food-security-crisis-opinion-1683791

>[Ukraine] has rich mineral deposits among which are uranium, titanium, manganese, iron and mercury ores. It has considerable shale gas resources that ranked third in Europe in terms of volume and 13th in the world. Similarly, its coal reserves ranked seventh in the world, first in ammonia production in Europe and has the world's second-largest gas pipeline system.
>Its agricultural sector is highly productive and is estimated that it can meet the food requirements of around 600 million people. It occupies second place in the world's barley production and fourth place in barley exports. It is the world's third-largest producer and fourth-largest exporter of corn. It is the fourth-largest producer of potatoes in the world and fifth-largest rye producer. It is fifth place in world bee production, eighth place in wheat exports and ninth place in chicken production.
>It is thus not easy for Russia to just give up a highly industrialized, productive and mineral rich client state. As a result, when Ukraine expressed its desire to become part of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, a military alliance of the US and leading Western European countries like the United Kingdom, Germany, France, Italy, Spain, among others, Russia was so threatened to have a breakaway country located right at the chest of its huge territory.
>farmers will apply less fertilizer due to its exorbitant price. In turn, this will lead to a reduction in our overall farm productivity.
>This simply means that pork and chicken prices will soon rise given that the cost of their feed inputs will also significantly increase, on top of the higher transport cost.

https://www.msn.com/en-ph/news/money/philippine-food-security-and-the-russian-ukraine-war/ar-AAUwfD2

I'm really curious, as morbidly as it sounds, how this war will actually accelerate infrastructural projects, changes supply chains in food, energy, also mobility in general. While some people fantasize about the long thought demise of the west, it could just accelerate changes that have been thought about before.
>>
No. 68951
>>68949
Idea that average Russian cares about VK being blocked in Alabama is insane.
>>
No. 68952
At any rate, I'm slowly amassing food. Wheat and rye flour, buckwheat, rice, peas, sugar. Need to refresh my arsenal of canned meat and fish too, maybe also freeze something. A large bottle of sunflower oil is resting in my frigde; probably going to buy another one. I was lucky enough to buy a big jar of good instant coffee comparatively cheap (circa 3 roubles per gram).
>>
No. 68953
>>68951
It's just one single example. Now everyone starts "banning" everything (with luck also holding some money paid by the Russian partners), it has spiralled totally out of control.
>>
No. 68954
2,5 MB, 1280 × 720, 0:32
>>68949
>Really, with these sanctions Putin's rating will soon skyrocket without him doing really anything - appearance of an actually threatening enemy
Well, that's just too bad. If the Russian people still don't understand cause and effect then you're really in for resurgence of USSR. If sanctions cause Putin's ratings to rise then so would any other possible method of intervention.

Here are the possible solutions according to your rhetoric:
Diplomacy with Putin - Impossible, Russia does what it wants unimpeded. Putin stronk wect weak. Long live Putin!
Military intervention - Muh WW3 and nukes, Russian people rally against wectern imperialist nazi offensive. Long live Putin!
Sanctions - The best way to react while not escalating. But wtf wect so evil they bully poor the poor Russian people. WE didn't cause this. Long live Putin!

You as a Russian probably have a less retarded take on your internal politics so please elaborate on an alternative solution. What should the west do instead of more sanctions?
>>
No. 68955 Kontra
>>68950
>changes
>accelerated
The optimism of those without any practical knowledge in any field is always astounding.
>>
No. 68956
>>68954
No one will really care about causes and effects when your immediate purpose is to survive and the Western nations (not Putin) are threatening that. "Survive together first, deal with the disagreements later." Half of the Russians live in poverty to begin with, which also has its strong impact on the mode of thinking.
>>
No. 68957
>>68956
Russia is going to be fine. It has an intense wealth of resources and can produce everything it needs.
>>
No. 68958 Kontra
>>68957
>It has an intense wealth of resources and can produce everything it needs.
Maybe the Congo will be fine too and its people will never experience extreme poverty.
>>
No. 68959
>>You as a Russian probably have a less retarded take on your internal politics so please elaborate on an alternative solution. What should the west do instead of more sanctions?

More targeted sanctions, perchance?)
But in the end you're doomed to make some dealings with Putin. I see simply no way around that at the moment. Some sensible concessions will be required in that case (not "remove NATO from Poland and Romania", of course, that's ridiculous).
>>
No. 68960
>>68954
According to Russians and Russia-boos, Russia should just get it's vital security needs met, which probably would be best served by a western border on the North Atlantic coast.
>>
No. 68961
>>68955
Why don't you enlighten us then?
>>
No. 68962
...And yes, there will be no removing Russia from Ukraine. Russia will take that piece even if doomed to go down with it. The best outcome for everyone would be the current government signing the necessary documents (at the very least declaring Ukraine as a neutral state, solving the question of Donbass somehow and recognizing Crimea as a Russian territory). I'm afraid that out leaders suck in diplomacy, though.
>>
No. 68963
130 kB, 558 × 867
71 kB, 800 × 450
>>68953
>it has spiralled totally out of control.
The WWE has cancelled all broadcasts in Russia. Surely Putin will back down now.
>>
No. 68964
>>68961
You are an idiot betting on a magic fairy that will come to rescue you.

Industrial machinery already runs on electricity, not gasoline engines, this is not the 1960s. The drive motors are all highly efficient servos. You won't get give efficiency gains. The situation is same wherever you look.

Germany's energy demands cannot be met by renewable production inside the country, this is not possible. Even forcing more renewable installations into service is not possible, due to shortages in supplies.

It is not possible to just order all the din-Rail clamps you need, some of them won't be available for a year.
Same with ICs, lead times are still months on some components. Same with HMIs. When an HMI at the customer breaks, we have to use outdated old stock. It is not possible to just order BLDC-kits, it takes month.

Whatever materials you need for electrical installations, there is always something that's not available.

When it is available, cost since last year has doubled or tripled, which is the case with many cables.

There won't be
>Hurr let's do this electrically it's easy
Or
>Durr replace this drive with a more efficient one

It is already a BLDC with closed loop control and energetic recovery, there are no more gains, we operate close to the theoretical limits.

There are no affordable solutions for grid-scale energy-storage, either.

Installation of a heat-pump for a single-family home is 40k€, and if we do that (with freshly printed government money, fuck inflation, no other way we are going to afford this without running ourselves), we will drive electricity demand in winter, when we have to little energy, anyway.

So we would not need grid scale energy storage, but seasonal energy storage. Which is even more impossible.

But, of course, you know better. In a declining economy crippled by shortages and extensive cost-shocks in resources and investment goods, Germany is going to turn it all around by massively investing in non-existent technology that does the impossible.

Believe me, this is going to suck hard. Standard of living will plummet massively. People's savings will be rendered worthless.
>>
No. 68965
1,2 MB, 720 × 720, 0:14
>>68959
>More targeted sanctions, perchance?)
Like the ones that were already in place? Right.

>Some sensible concessions will be required in that case (not "remove NATO from Poland and Romania", of course, that's ridiculous)
So maybe stop NATO expansion i.e. block sovereign states like Finland and Sweden from joining a defensive alliance? Or what are these "sensible consessions" of yours?
>>
No. 68966 Kontra
>>68964
You seem to imply I was talking about one year, I'm talking about decades, not some magical one-year energy autarky. Depending on how this conflict is going on, renewables seem a way out of international dependencies, in a world of international capital rivalry, it could be a useful investment, I'm also talking about investments in R&D. Of course you will need supply chains for making the technology.
>>
No. 68967
>>68965
>>Like the ones that were already in place? Right.
There is a lot of very different sanctions in place. But that avalanche of private "sanctions" certainly needs to be stopped somehow. As I said, the Western mass-media have clearly overdone their job here.

The University of Milan almost cancelled its course on Dostoyevsky, for Christ's sake (they actually did but then reconsidered). Now imagine what thousands of private companies do. Especially when they can get away with the money.

>>So maybe stop NATO expansion i.e. block sovereign states like Finland and Sweden from joining a defensive alliance? Or what are these "sensible consessions" of yours?
Ask Putin, frankly. Then ask again. And again. It's basically what talks are about. But Russia has every right to be paranoid about NATO, and that paranoia won't go in the upcoming decades, so that factor must be taken into serious consideration.
>>
No. 68969
>>
No. 68971
More on fights over supply chains and dependency:

>We’ve heard Putin say that he intends to have Russia benefit from the climate crisis by opening up new trade routes, new agricultural lands, and being a breadbasket powerhouse for the global economy in the future. Putin is trying to hoard agricultural lands for Russia’s food security, thereby also increasing the world’s future dependence on Russia in agricultural markets.
>And then there is another point that I find is really missing from the current conversation. In 2021, the European Union struck a partnership with Ukraine on supply chains for critical materials that are necessary for decarbonization and for digitalization. So Russia’s invasion of Ukraine can be seen as an attempt to hoard mineral resources in addition to agricultural ones by gaining access to mineral resources outside of its territory.
>This is a pattern of behavior that we’re seeing more and more on the part of Russia: to try to become a power broker and to carve out spheres of influence in the world, be it in Ukraine, the Central African Republic, in Mali. Since climate transitions are accelerating and energy systems are changing, Russia wants to influence how other countries and regions, including the European Union, will be able to effectively move to renewables and maintain democratic, geoeconomic, and socioeconomic resilience in the face of climate change. Russia and China both aim to use supply chains, which are now connecting to how we regear the global economy in the face of disruptions, to try to carve out dependency relationships. So climate transitions are playing into the way international relationships are changing, and there is an impetus for the European Union to really use its geopolitical influence to enhance this notion of co-resilience and co-adaptation. This is why climate finance is becoming one key aspect of a sustainable future for all: we all depend on this ability to redistribute resources and to use transitions as a transformative power for equalization and for equity across the world.

https://carnegieeurope.eu/2022/03/04/russia-s-ukraine-invasion-and-climate-change-go-hand-in-hand-pub-86574
>>
No. 68972
>>68951
First of all, "average Russian" is 45 years old woman. In democracy where 1 person = 1 vote her opinion would matter. In our situation nor Putin nor Americans care much about what she thinks.
>>
No. 68973
>>68969
Thanks, actually valuable information.
>>
No. 68975
>>68967
> But that avalanche of private "sanctions" certainly needs to be stopped somehow
Avalanche doesn't "need" anything. Let's specify who needs it to be stopped and for what purpose.

> Ask Putin, frankly. Then ask again. And again.
Bruh :DD
But seriously, westerners used policy of "appeasement of aggressor" 80 years ago. Worked not so well.
>>
No. 68976
>>68966
>You seem to imply I was talking about one year, I'm talking about decades, not some magical one-year energy autarky.
What do decades matter when we you will be fucked within a year?

I hate this as much as the next guy, but 16 years of Business-as-usual and no-changes got us here, and it will be incredibly hard to get out of it.
>>
No. 68978
>>68967
>But that avalanche of private "sanctions" certainly needs to be stopped somehow. As I said, the Western mass-media have clearly overdone their job here.
Capital is a shy herd of Zebra, when one runs, they all run. Your president has scared the herd, and they won't stop running for quite a time. They will be hesitant to come back to this grazing grounds even after what scared them is gone.

Western governments do not control private businesses to an extent where they can force them to do business in Russia. When Facebook decides they don't want Russian customers, that's that, no one will stop them.
>>
No. 68979
>>68976
>it will be incredibly hard to get out of it.

I never said it would be an easy way or work 100% through, certainly, big transitions will come with costs and perils and all. And I don't like praying the apocalypse, but I'd also agree that the heavenly days are over, die fetten Jahre sind vorbei. For some there never have been these years and they will suffer even more. But this nonetheless won't mean European governments will not seek means to stabilize their system which also means diversification of supply and shifts in supply. Crisis seems to be default mode of our age, because many decisions seem crucial in such an interconnected world, was Corona equally apocalyptic at first?
Surely, was initially got me uncomfortable and such is not people die not that far away now in a conflict actual people involved have no interest in, but the danger of a supply chain collapse and an ensuing fight over supply chains and thus system stability and overall provision of materials/products of great use-value.
>>
No. 68980 Kontra
10,7 MB, 854 × 480, 2:07
>>68967
I was asking your opinion specifically on what you consider as a "sensible concessions".
>>
No. 68981
>>68975
>>But seriously, westerners used policy of "appeasement of aggressor" 80 years ago. Worked not so well.

Not ad Hitlerum again. Hitler didn't hide his purposes at all, it's basically all in Mein Kampf. Chamberlain was simply a fool if he had convinced himself that Hitler would settle for anything less than the new world order. Comparing that situation to Putin (who just needs security and some prestige) is ridiculous.

>Avalanche doesn't "need" anything. Let's specify who needs it to be stopped and for what purpose.
Everyone. It disrupts any possibility of a meaningful diplomatic dialogue in the first place.
>>
No. 68982
>>68981
>Putin (who just needs security and some prestige

Where is our security guarantee for that? How can we be sure he's not wanting to roll West until he can re-instate the Berlin Wall and return everything to 1989?
>>
No. 68983 Kontra
>>68981
> Comparing that situation to Putin (who just needs security and some prestige) is ridiculous.
But it isn't. You should be familiar with the term "lebensraum". Combine it with not so covert implications that the restoration of the Russian empire is desirable and you get a fairly comparable situation. It may be that the current leaders are not 100% on board with the idea but the idea exists in the sphere surrounding it.
>>
No. 68984
>>68980
Meaning if I were Putin? )
Pre-war, that would be convincing Ukraine into declaring a neutral status (explicitly blocking NATO membership to certain countries is bad for business), recognizing the status of Crimea and solving the question of Donbass somehow. Russia could put some funds into that in exchange for lifting the sanctions.

Now it's basically the same, but more complicated. Anyway, Russia doesn't have any immediate national interests in Europe beyond securing the Russian-speaking regions, protecting its existing military bases and economical collaboration with the EU. Removing the American anti-missiles (which do upset the global balance of security) would be the top ambition, I suppose.
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No. 68985
215 kB, 1276 × 799
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIgqhU4lkgo
Was Moscow apartment bombings an inside job?
https://web.archive.org/web/20120210221753/http://vip.lenta.ru/doc/2002/05/14/prosecutors/
Was 4 September and inside job and they killed everyone from Litvenko to all those journalists to help cover it up? Who controls Putin?
>>
No. 68986
>>68983
Come on. Restoration of the Russian Empire might be someone's wet dream but it's obviously 100% unrealistic, and Putin knows that perfectly well. We've even basically left the Baltic states alone, despite their chauvinistic interior policies and open Russophobia on the international level.

By God, Putin demands a sphere of influence, not "lebensraum for ethnic Russians" (where have you even got that idea?). Modern Russia is a normal fascist state, not a bunch of some brain-dead Nazi fanatics.
>>
No. 68987
>>68981
>meaningful diplomatic dialogue in the first place
Truly the West just threw away all possibilities of dialogue and diplomatic understanding with their excessive sanctions :DD Russia can't trust the western states anymore, they're too volatile! Probably can't be relied upon to commit their end of diplomatic agreements either!
>>
No. 68988
>>68985
>>Was Moscow apartment bombings an inside job?
We'll never know for sure but I find that unlikely. The risks and the benefits are incomparable (after all, the terrorist threat was quite real and obvious even without that). All sources claiming otherwise also had reasons to be lying.
>>
No. 68990
>>68982
>>How can we be sure he's not wanting to roll West until he can re-instate the Berlin Wall and return everything to 1989?

Because he has no military means for that? :) I mean, look at Ukraine. Granted, NATO also has some reasons to be paranoid about Russia, but we must deal with that common paranoia somehow by producing some agreement where both sides can feel sufficiently secure.

I have to remind that everything started in 2014 in Ukraine, which Russia always considered as the area of its vital interests (while Europe had just barely learned not to mix it with Russia).
>>
No. 68991
>>68981
What Sweden i Germany said, that premise ridiculous of him only wanting some prestige and not creating new world order or at very least reestablish scary Mordor Russian empire. What "prestige" even mean? Because for him a new imperial Russia would be that.

>>68971
See here is thing very stupid people don't understand about climate change, which is it totally destablizes entire world economic and political order at the same time. This is why the Pentagon regards it as our top national security thread, because rather than just have one rival or opfor to worry about it's like a shotgun blast coming from every angle and meanwhile we stop being able to fuel and feed our own people anyone either while this is happening. Which frankly for all what the one deranged German farmer keeps saying, it's the true face of the world economic only it isn't ever going to end. It's why Moroccan phosphorus is so important, and why the spookiest thing I heard yet is claims of Ukraine being first in the world for ammonia reserves. It'd be worth invading them for that alone.

I come to realize I don't think any of you actually seems to realize what protracted hard times we're going to be in for by the time we're older men, and what future our children and grandchildren, if any, would be fighting for, killing each other over the last surviving scraps of the old orders. Of course I am also skeptical of shitty Russian permafrost having much solid use as a global breadbasket, but certainly it's going to be more useful than what's left of California, if anything. Texas and Arizona won't exist which will be interesting in that their lack of rain and remoteness could better preserve the ghosts of pre-great fall modernist civilizations.
>>
No. 68992
>>68991
>This is why the Pentagon regards it as our top national security thread
Then why does America insist on burning all oil and gas it can possibly get out of the planet?
>>
No. 68993
>>68991
>What "prestige" even mean? Because for him a new imperial Russia would be that.
It would. Ruling the world also would. But I soomehow suppose he could be satisfied by far less.
Russians typically value prestige (collective and individual) quite a lot. Unluckily.
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No. 68995
64 kB, 1179 × 773
>>68990
>everything started in 2014 in Ukraine

Ukraine was in crisis between Western and Eastern alignment since its founding. 2014 crisis was the result of the government stopping EU talks after the Eastern side had won in 2012, which was an election that should have been held in 2008, after there was no conclusive result in 2004 and so on...

I remember well being on a kind of Model EU thing in 2001 in Berlin where we made proposals for its further development. There was this lone Ukrainian guy who always wanted to come back to accession talks, but he was largely ignored because of the unclear situation with the two halves of the country.

It's not like West Europeans have never heard of a country of 40 million that's just one border away from Germany, it's just that we never wanted to meddle in its internal conflicts. Russia clearly did, and now if you think this involvement somehow justifies aggressive involvement, even invasion, you got it completely backwards.
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No. 68996
87 kB, 500 × 636
I still can't believe in all this shit.
>>
No. 68997
>>68981
I'm curious which specific sanction made you switch from military hysteria and "haha, take it, NATO and hohols!" to "pls no bully, what about meaningful diplomatic dialogue???".

The pidorushka cries out in pain as he strikes you
>>
No. 68998
>>68997
Maybe he can't play Elden Ring anymore.
>>
No. 68999
>>68996
How are you holding up?
>>
No. 69003
>>68995
They could have just have had a happy divorce like Tschechoslowakia.
>>
No. 69005
Oh, I didn't notice the first thread has gone the way of Russian individual food rations.

>16463079385820.mp4
>(Mostly) unarmed little green men standing around chatting

I don't understand Russian, what's going on there? Thanks
>>
No. 69007
>>68995
>It's not like West Europeans have never heard of a country of 40 million that's just one border away from Germany,
Yeah, let's be honest. Until 2004, most people just thought it was like a weird version of Russia that shouldn't really be it's own country. Just some weird pseudo-Russia under a different name, like Belarus.
>>
No. 69009
>>68997
>>I'm curious which specific sanction made you switch from military hysteria and "haha, take it, NATO and hohols!" to "pls no bully, what about meaningful diplomatic dialogue???"
Me and mylitary hysteria in one sentence?..
I've even started a peaceful petition on change.org soon after the war broke out (because the one by Ponomaryov is unacceptably formulated - no patrot of Russia could sign it in his right mind).
>>
No. 69012
>>69007
You could say this about any ex soviet country, but then again I doubt anyone ever thought it "shouldn't really be it's own country".
>>
No. 69013
44 kB, 800 × 450
I remember someone talking about biolabs conspiracy theory. Head of communist party of Russia is on board with it:

https://t.me/uranews/44688
> Fifteen biological laboratories have been placed along the perimeter of our borders, where there is not a single Ukrainian employee, only American specialists preparing new bacteria to poison Russia and its people. Five such laboratories were located in Georgia and nine in Kazakhstan. Therefore, it is no coincidence that during the military-political operation these 15 laboratories in Ukraine were destroyed by the Russian Armed Forces.
>>
No. 69014
>>69013
>Five such laboratories were located in Georgia and nine in Kazakhstan.
Wait, 14 of 15 ukrainian biolabs were not located in Ukraine?
>>
No. 69015
>>69014
Don't try to understand it. Just internalize that wisdom.
>>
No. 69016
>>69012
No, people said
>Russia, Ukraine, White Russia, isn't that all the same?
Of course, old people even today can't tell Japan from China, so there's that.
>>
No. 69017
>>69014
I think it works like this:
Five in Georgia, nine in Kazakhstan and fifteen in Ukraine.

So it adds up to 29. I guess Russia will need to invade some more countries to find number 30.
>>
No. 69018 Kontra
>>69014
No. 5 + 9 + 15 = 29 in total
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No. 69019
89 kB, 607 × 621
>>68986
>Restoration of the Russian Empire might be someone's wet dream but it's obviously 100% unrealistic, and Putin knows that perfectly well
<Nah, Gitler isn't THAT crazy, he's not REALLY going to genocide ze juice.
Finally got my chance to play the nazi card.

You do realize that when the head of state of an authoritarian former superpower rallies its people behind an idea that there's probably at least a kernel of truth in there. How is anyone supposed to gauge what Putin really means or doesn't when you look at what he's done. According to you Russia has all the reasons to be paranoid about NATO, but the western world is supposed to be an oracle that sees right through Putin's words to what the true actions will be. Which quite obviously isn't the case gauging the reactions to your invasion. Even when the military intelligence was saying that it's going to happen not many believed it. All while your President assured everyone that it was all just hysteria by western media.

How is anyone supposed to resort to diplomacy with a leader like that?
>>
No. 69021
>>69019
Yes, but let us asses the situation calmly and hope the other side does the same. Madman or not, keeping Disney movies out Russia is not doing anything to stop him.
>>
No. 69022
>>69021
>let us asses the situation calmly and hope the other side does the same.
>and hope the other side does the same.
lmao
>>
No. 69024
>>69019
It's okay to play the Hitler card now, it's pretty close in terms of foreign policy and possibly misreading it. Even when George W. Bush's 2003 Iraq crusade thingy is probably still more appropriate, we still don't really know why he did it.
>>
No. 69025
>>69022
>lmao
OK, you want to pretend Russians being blocked from video games is going to stop Putin, whom you consider a madman dictator bent for world domination?

It's useless if you are right, it's useless if you are wrong. What is the point?
>>
No. 69026 Kontra
>>69025
You misunderstood me. I was laughing because of your silly statement, not because I disagreed with your opinion on video game sanctions.
>>
No. 69027
>>68988
> All sources claiming otherwise also had reasons to be lying.
But there are not just "claims" from different sources. There are facts like call from terrorists flats to Lubyanka, analysis by Ryazan department of FSB which showed that material in bags was hexogen. Evacuation of people wouldn't happen if it was just a "drill". Actions of federal authorities also link to conspiracy.
Official version doesn't add up with reality at all. Meanwhile false flag attack explains everything and makes sense.

>>68985
>Who controls Putin?
I've read articles from early 00-s and there was such story: Putin fired two FSB officials (one general and one colonel IIRC), but they "refused to be fired" and continued to work.
But by this moment (2022) he seems to have built the "vertical of power", is not controlled by anyone and rules country by himself.
>>
No. 69028 Kontra
>>68986
As I said, the current leaders may not be in on it 100% but they are mingling with crackpots who express those ideas. Also whenever Sweden says something we get threatened with Poltava. If that isn't sort of hinting at the mighty Russian empire that you should fear, pleas tell me what it is.
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No. 69029
60 kB, 711 × 469
63 kB, 711 × 450
50 kB, 709 × 399
There is the Kim's looking at stuff and there is Putin sitting on long tables.
>>
No. 69030
>>68991
>I come to realize I don't think any of you actually seems to realize what protracted hard times we're going to be in for by the time we're older men, and what future our children and grandchildren, if any, would be fighting for, killing each other over the last surviving scraps of the old orders.

It's worded quite dramatically but I also feel like some things definitely change, for all parties involved and it does not look rosy. Only time after time will we grasp what happen(d/s). The classic capitalist analysis would represent it as what usually happens in a national rivalry within the capitalist world order and the resources that are at stake only support that. I read an article that argues and points at the end of cheap living, cheap production and such and this war could then be seen as some kind of prelude.

>>69029
Are there any theories on why that happens? A symbol of domination? Frankly, I think it looks rather goofy because it is bend into the comical with that distance in between. Like a teenager bragging. At least it is memeworthy then, wouldn't be surprised if it was already turned into countless memes where things are place in the empty space of the table.
>>
No. 69031
501 kB, 1920 × 1080
105 kB, 960 × 540
70 kB, 1100 × 619
125 kB, 1200 × 788
>>69030
>Are there any theories on why that happens?

I heard he's afraid of the coronas but of course that was just some news site getting ideas.

But it might be possible.
>>
No. 69036
Putin calls sanctions 'a declaration of war'.
It's just a special economical transaction, dude. Calm down.
>>
No. 69037
167 kB, 1084 × 664
"Deep people" blame greedy hucksters for rising prices, not Putin or West.
>>
No. 69039
>>69019
Any sane Russian will tell you that Russian officials cannot be blindly trusted (not just Putin). However, diplomacy isn't exactly about trust, more about just setting common frameworks. Both sides are de-facto free to break a treaty, but in that case both will suffer. Conventions where one side relies entirely on the good will of the other are nearly doomed from the start. Note that Russia has been duped by its western sworn partners more than once as well. Still, it's not the reason not to try negotiating.
>>
No. 69040
>>69031
Looks more like he's afraid of snuffboxes.

>>69027
>>There are facts like call from terrorists flats to Lubyanka, analysis by Ryazan department of FSB which showed that material in bags was hexogen.
Can I verify them?
>>
No. 69041
>>69030
>Are there any theories on why that happens?
Some say it's because foreign leider refuse to get Russian-administered Corona-tests. After all, that would give Russia DNA-samples. So Putin places them at the end of enormously long tables so he won't get infected. OK, but that would still be somewhat paranoid, right?

And it would not explain why he has his generals sit 20m away.

So what remains is Putin bragging that he's the boss with the longest tables.
Same I'm-the-boss-shit he did when he had his Labrador come into a meeting to scare Merkel.

To be honest, I think he works everyone like he worked his assets when he was a KGB-officer.
Success kind of speaks for itself.
>>
No. 69045
>>69041
I heard the same just now with the refusal of PCR tests from some foreign leaders like France and Germany and that he is indeed in fear of catching corona, could make him look weak. Some leaders did not refuse but had to take multiple test and the general that sits far away was meeting a brit high tier mandate guy before who had corona according to that news page.
>>
No. 69048
>>69045
When given the choice between possibly looking weak due to what amounts to flu-like symptoms for most people and certainly looking paranoid bordering on deranged, Putin chooses the latter.

Maybe it's strategy. Making the world think he's a madman could give him a strategic edge. It didn't work for Nixon, but maybe Nixon just didn't act mad enough.
>>
No. 69050
>>69040
Yes, that's what even FSB themselves don't deny:
https://youtu.be/g7EcGJcCcVo?t=1688
>>
No. 69052
>>
No. 69053
>>69013
KPRF always delivers. I can now predict developments in Russian esoteric politics with about a week delay. Maybe Russian propaganda tests out concepts with Brazilian test groups before releasing them to the general public.
>>
No. 69056
370 kB, 640 × 640
Belarusian chief of staff has apparently resigned because belarusian troops refuse to support Ukraine invasion? Is this true?
>>
No. 69057
>>69056
Hell knows. None of us can surely know what's true now, it's war.
>>
No. 69059
>>69057
Sometimes we can.
If hohols say that they killed Russian general, that's highly likely military propaganda, but if Russians confirm it, it must be true (they wouldn't lie against their own agenda).
Same if there are PROOFS.

>>69056
Belorussians say it's fake.
>>
No. 69063
2,2 MB, 3840 × 2160
I think that "climate change" is a just mere smokescreen for what's going on currently. It's not the root cause of the issue.
For the past 30 years the West was the major "power" in the world, now over time other countries started catching up with it - China, Russia, India, Brazil and others, like Turkey and Iran.
Because some people see geopolitics as a zero sum game (maybe rightfully so) this is seen as a threat to the established world order and ultimately the quality of life on the West. As East and Latin America get richer, the West becomes poorer.

When Russia/China/India openly challenge the western hegemony - everything on the west starts falling apart because everything was built around the west being a hegemony.
1)- First thing's first - Fuel.
For americans this is crucial cause the entire thing is car-centric. For europeans it's also important but it's mostly about natural gas and coal. Europeans were smart enough to get rid of their car-centric shit in the 2000s and make the push for walkable cities. In the US and Canada it will probably turn into a mess far worse than 1970s. This is where all the green energy, biking and electric car propaganda comes in.
2)- Food
As someone already mentioned before, food wil become an issue on the west, mainly due to the large population but also because of the rising prices for energy sources. To feed a population this big you need food, to make food you need electricity and ultimately fuel. Expensive food means famines.
This why vegan stuff, soy food and other crap is being pushed by all the media. Meat is expensive and it's impossible to feed everyone with meat under such circumstances.
3)- Consumer goods
Will rise in prices as well, on that note i believe that years of dirt cheap clothing like H&M and Zara are gone. Possibly forever gone. When China will invade Taiwan - prices consumer electronics prices also surge. Many modern cars rely on this so cars will also become expensive. Hence why "you will own nothing" meme by Herr Schwab is the actual reality. They were just trying to prepare western normies for what's eventually happen. You will buy less not because it's good for the climate but because you won't be able to afford it.

Essentially what i believe is that western media basically flipped the reason and outcome upside down and called it "climate change". Technically they are not lying because the climate IS changing. The geopolitical climate.
As for the Ukraine - i believe that US has tried to pull another Pakistan. Create a meme country that has nukes which kinda exists to contain Russia. Same goes for Taiwan. Or Israel. It's a major obstacle. But because the US has run out of time this has not happened and now "green energy" is a thing because if you don't fool normies they will revolt and it's the worst outcome for the West.
I might be wrong in my analysis so please feel free to provide different arguments and tell me where i might be wrong.
>>
No. 69067 Kontra
1,0 MB, 800 × 605, 0:03
>>69063
I don't get why so many people think that everything that happens in the world has to be orchestrated by shadowy dark forces with unknown motives.

Do you deny the climate is changing? Because that's trivial to show you. Or just that it's a problem we have to do something about? Which we could argue about, but not ITT.

Everything else you mentioned, from my perspective, is just additional reasons why some policies might turn out well and might be preferable solutions, in a global context. None of it is relevant to this thread.
>>
No. 69068 Kontra
>>69067
Yes, because i have not personally experienced any negative effects from this so called climate change. How can i say with 100% certainty that it is indeed happening if i have not experienced it?
At best i can say "maybe".
I can tell that major geopolitical/economic crisis is happening because obviously there's clear evidence in the form of rising prices all over the world.
>>
No. 69070 Kontra
>>69068
You don't have to experience it to know about it. It's like saying "I don't know if Australia exists, because I was never there." Knowing is never 100%, we could all live in a Matrix. There's no difference between measuring rising prices and rising temperatures.
>>
No. 69072
>>69067
>I don't get why so many people think that everything that happens in the world has to be orchestrated by shadowy dark forces with unknown motives.
Conspirational view of world history, I suspect these people were lied to a lot by their parents when they were children, so they believe everything is a lie. Unless it comes from an authoritarian father-figure, then you better believe it, or else.
>>
No. 69073 Kontra
965 kB, 0:16
1,1 MB, 2349 × 2067
1,1 MB, 2349 × 2067
On Friday, Agence Second France Press had a teaser saying the Russians "attacked ritual cars":
>Die Eroberer blockierten die Notfallstation und griffen rituelle Autos an.
I was puzzled and had to read the article and check the original version to understand that's what cars to transport dead bodies ("hearses"?) are called in Russian and Ukrainian.

Also on Friday, a German war analyst said "Kiel" instead of "Kiew" [2]:
>Kiel ist allerdings noch nicht eingeschlossen, aber ganz offensichtlich ist es weiterhin das Ziel der russischen Truppen: Im Norden der Stadt stehen weiterhin viele Kampfverbände, einige rücken weiter wohl … westlich vor, am Westrand der Stadt, und vom–von Osten her stoßen ebenfalls russische Truppen auf Ki[ew? Kiel?] vor, und von Süden her rücken ebenfalls russische Verbände vor.

Also, when you invert the colours, it looks like Putin is sitting in front of Ukrainian or Polish flags. Mere coincidence?

Please direct any complaints about "is this war a joke to you" this way.

[1] https://www.ukrinform.de/rubric-ato/3420362.html
[2] https://mediandr-a.akamaihd.net/download/podcasts/podcast2998/AU-20220304-1730-2300.mp3
>>
No. 69074
Ukraine just introduced sever restrictions on the export of sunflower seeds, sunflower oil and grain.
>>
No. 69075
88 kB, 794 × 742
92 kB, 797 × 690
44 kB, 917 × 507
>>69063
>For the past 30 years the West was the major "power" in the world, now over time other countries started catching up with it - China, Russia, India, Brazil and others, like Turkey and Iran.
Wishful thinking. The only country out of this list which has seen any real increase in economic or military power is China. Iran and Turkey can act as regional powers because the US blew their surroundings to smithereens.
>>
No. 69079 Kontra
>>69063
Reminds me of people at a party that want to explain the world to you in 10 principles but you just know it will be a horrible talk and you wonder how the fuck to back out from this convo and fuck off to somebody else and have a good/interesting conversation.
>>
No. 69080 Kontra
>>69079
Maybe you should attend less lame parties.
>>
No. 69082 Kontra
>>69080
Almost every party with at least two digit number of people will have those.
>>
No. 69083
48 kB, 789 × 519
77 kB, 1000 × 743
23 kB, 509 × 250
29 kB, 525 × 297
>>68814
>For americans this is crucial cause the entire thing is car-centric.
Canada has twice the oil reserves of Russia. Other than Russia, they have an economy that does not entirely rely on ressource extraction. This oil sits right on Americas northern border. I think they will be fine.

>For europeans it's also important but it's mostly about natural gas and coal. Europeans were smart enough to get rid of their car-centric shit in the 2000s and make the push for walkable cities.
I don't know where you got this idea, but that never happened. There was no
>push for walkable cities
Most European cities are as walkable or un-walkable as they have been for the last 6 decades. Motorization rate has slightly increased since 1990.

>In the US and Canada it will probably turn into a mess far worse than 1970s. This is where all the green energy, biking and electric car propaganda comes in.
I will abstain from commenting on your view of all media and culture being controlled by some ominous central authority.

1.) Being "green" as a subculture has been around in the USA since the sixties started by the book "silent spring" and in Europa since the mid seventies ignited by the anti-nuclear movement and the outrage about the seveso-disaster. It is by now, a six decade long societal trend.
2.) It was met by very considerable establishment backlash for decades.
3.) Even before the effects of increasing the CO2-content of the athmosphere have been widely acknowledged, the local adverse effects of oil- and coal- burning on air-quality, vegetation and health were observable. In industrial areas, walls were black from soot, children were asthmatic, etc.

>As someone already mentioned before, food wil become an issue on the west, mainly due to the large population but also because of the rising prices for energy sources.
Population in most western nations is stable or declining, and it has been that way for decades.
Under the premise of declining agricultural output due to rising energy prices, who will be able to afford rising food prices for food produced in western countries better
1.) Domestic costumers in western countries
2.) Large-scale importing mid-income countries
Compare the largest importers and exporters of wheat, for example.
>>
No. 69084 Kontra
>>69082
Weird, I've been to numerous parties with at least a two digit number of people and have never once encountered such a person. Maybe you should associate with less lame people.
>>
No. 69085 Kontra
>>69079
>you wonder how the fuck to back out from this convo and fuck off to somebody else
By saying you don't like the conversation and want to talk to someone else? By being you know, honest? :D
>>
No. 69087 Kontra
>>69085
Yeah, why not shit on the table and be, you know, honest?

Not one of the other two Germanballs, by the way. I am not even as cool as the uncool Germanball, I never ever have been to a party with more than ten people present.
The cool Germanball who has been to numerous parties would probably immediatly know that I am a societal reject and loser 1 second after he laid eyes on me and think of me as some pathetic piece of shit without a social life.

God, how I hate the cool kids.
>>
No. 69091 Kontra
>>69087
Clearly telling someone like me to fuck off with his "deep and edgy teenage thinker" nihilistic attitude towards life is a whole lot different than taking a huge load on the table that actually requires you to climb the table and strain.
Somehow people love to attack my personality a lot instead of attacking the argument that i'm making.
>>
No. 69093 Kontra
>>69091
>Somehow people love to attack my personality a lot
Maybe it has to do with your personality.
>>
No. 69094 Kontra
>>69091
He's trolling, most likely, as if he really were such a social reject incel loser he wouldn't have been invited to the party in the first place.
If he's legit, we should all laugh at him.
>>
No. 69095
>>69073
>>On Friday, Agence Second France Press had a teaser saying the Russians "attacked ritual cars"
Absolutely fabulous translation.
>>
No. 69096 Kontra
>>69087
>Not one of the other two Germanballs, by the way.
You are underestimating the number of distinct German posters ITT.
>>
No. 69098 Kontra
>>69073
>Also on Friday, a German war analyst said "Kiel" instead of "Kiew"
I am convinced that this man is not a "war analyst" or any other kind of analyst, but a radio speaker. You can hear that he has a professional speaking voice. Not even the meme-experts they have on radio are that incompetent. Ridiculous, still.
>>
No. 69099 Kontra
>>69094
Oh god, your cool-kid act is so fucking annoying. Still not him, by the way.
>>
No. 69101 Kontra
>>69099
Struck a nerve there, eh?
>>
No. 69102 Kontra
>>69101
I admitted as much in >>69087, didn't I?
But why the fuck do you go on imageboards and put on the
>I have been to sooooooo many parties
>and they have been waaaaaaay cooler than the parties you have been to.

Still not him, you fucken asshole. That guy has been invited, me not.

Since I am a worthless piece of shit, right?
Since I am like such an assburger.

Fucken worthless disgusting geek untermensch misscaraige mongoloid retard, right?

That's what you are here to tell me right?

Go, fuck yourself. Go and fuck fucken asshole.
>>
No. 69103 Kontra
>>69101
FUCK FUCK FUCK

Why can you make me this angry and I can do nothing to you?
HOW IS THIS POSSIBLE?

WHATEVER I DO WHEREVER I GO EVERYONE IS TEN TIME BETTER THAN ME AND WORHT TEN TIMES MORE THAN ME

WHY AM I SUCH A WORTHLESS PIECE OF SHIT WHY WHY WHY WHY WHY
>>
No. 69105 Kontra
>>69093
Maybe or it is? You should speak your mind clearly otherwise a guy like me could keep going. Just say it already! Come on! Insult me! I know you want to.
>>
No. 69107 Kontra
>>69102
Maybe we should keep the autistic screeching out of the serious thread, shall we? If you want, we can continue on /fefe/.
>>
No. 69109 Kontra
>>69107
Maybe we shouldn't use the serious thread to tell everyone how fucking popular and good with people and all-around great we are, while everyone else is shit.
>>
No. 69113
>>69084
Maybe your parties are full of those people or worse: your are such a guy :DDD

And in case you thought you are talking to just one other German, no, we are three in here.

>>69091
>instead of attacking the argument that i'm making

Some people reject doing the work of Sisyphus, my pattern recognition has been trained very well being on imageboards for such a long time, welelele.
>>
No. 69115 Kontra
>>69113
>Maybe your parties are full of those people or worse: your are such a guy :DDD
I have literally spent nights discussing communism and anarchism, but I have never, even once, encountered someone like you described or tried explaining the world like you described, so...

Also,
> we are three in here.
We are at least three in here.
>>
No. 69116 Kontra
>>69113
>And in case you thought you are talking to just one other German, no, we are three in here.
I posit: we are at least three.
>>
No. 69117
709 kB, 8401 × 6293
>>
No. 69118
>>69115
>I have literally spent nights discussing communism and anarchism
Jokes on you. Some guy in adidas sweater with an i-phone in his hand started a sentence with
>Adorno once said
I excused myself, left and never looked back. I have no time to listen to such bullshit from idiots.
>>
No. 69119
>>69115
>I have literally spent nights discussing communism and anarchism, but I have never, even once, encountered someone like you described or tried explaining the world like you described, so...

My wording was quite reduced, but these topics don't exclude such people. I also have a specific party in mind when I just listened to 4 guys arguen over politics and just that there listened smoking and observing the room and eventually got waved away, and I normally are part of these people discussing such topics on parties. I haven't been to much parties in the past and the once I have been were mostly with closer friends and other ties, but every once in a while I find myself on parties with more people and this usually means also more people I don't know and a bigger mix of opinions and such, which makes it more likely to meet such people.

>>69118
What's the problem, reading Adorno and having branded products does not exclude itself. Seems like you have no good idea of what Adorno even said. And I say that while I've never been interested much in him, but read parts of is oeuvre anyway.
>>
No. 69120 Kontra
54 kB, 551 × 600
>>69118
>with an i-phone in his hand
Phew, couldn't have been me, I had those discussions before iphones had spread. Also, see pic related.

>>69117
I had a laugh. Some of my fellow countryballs are really autistic and don't understand banter or irony or anything (which is why they're all such losers :^).
>>
No. 69121 Kontra
>>69119
>What's the problem, reading Adorno and having branded products does not exclude itself
The facts proof that.

>seems like you have no good idea of what Adorno even said. And I say that while I've never been interested much in him, but read parts of is oeuvre anyway.
Educate me on why there is no contradiction in making a huge monetary effort to partake in mass culture, then quoting a critic of capitalism and the cultural industry.
>>
No. 69125
465 kB, 713 × 989
Back to the war, please
>>
No. 69126
>>69125
>Back to the war, please
You shouldn't say that as a german :--DDDD
>>
No. 69127
>>69095
Their English translations are better. I wonder why they bother with German translations, who do they think even reads those? Also I'm disappointed the Russians aren't attacking actual ritual Ukrainian cars driven by hohol shamans.

>>69098
Right, by "war analyst", I just meant you can listen to him talk about a war. But this is from the blurb:
>In dieser Folge sprechen der langjährige ARD-Korrespondent Carsten Schmiester und der sicherheitspolitische Experte des NDR, Andreas Flocken, darüber, wie es für die Menschen in der Ukraine nun weitergehen kann blabla
The "Kiel" guy is Flocken, not Schmiester.
Judging from the two episodes I've half heard so far, it's mostly yesterday's news but in German. As is the case with most of our Ö-R media.

>incompetent
>Ridiculous
Are you talking about the "Kiel" thing? That was a slip, could happen to any of us. Especially if he's more happenings expert than professional radio speaker.
>>
No. 69128
>>69121
Because said critic of capitalism did not say you cannot critique capitalism while being part of it, since it forms a totality (which can be broken from within nonetheless). I never read negative dialectics which is quite important to grasp his work in general (maybe thinking the non-identity really is one take away but I don't know, but if its true for that work, than it points to the contradiction and paradoxy that life under capitalism comes with). For Dialketik der Aufklärung I can say something general: I know that the individual is the target and victim of capitalism (its culture industry in particular here) but also the solution to overcome it (Adorno was still an enlightenment thinker, very deep in its tradition).

Also think of this sentence:

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Es_gibt_kein_richtiges_Leben_im_falschen

Insisting on the right life, while still under wrong conditions that haunt you (you buy branded stuff for example). And if you ask now why don't people just don't buy stuff, Adorno, hm? ...Adorno was fond a psychoanalysis and took part in a discourse about the masses that was not uncommon for the first half of the 20th century.
>>
No. 69129
3,6 MB, 500 × 400, 0:19
I'm pretty sure as especially the last couple dozen posts shows, the problem isn't even American shitposting, but Germanism, which constitutes a great deal of Americans. If you follow the same insane reaction to masks and vaccines, it largely seems clustered within German-American states and central Europe.

>>69116
Literally exactly the same gets said by Americans during their arguments. Germans are like some indistinguishable schizophrenic mass in fact this >>69102 is like
Swabian asked me to borrow gram of fertilizer, society literally collapsed.
>>
No. 69130
748 kB, 1249 × 2058
>>69125
Here, have the full resolution version instead.

>Russian forces may attempt amphibious landings anywhere along the Black Sea Coast from Odesa to the mouth of the Southern Bug in the next 24–48 hours.
Can they hurry up already? I have to wörk tomorrow.
>>
No. 69131 Kontra
>>69128
>Because said critic of capitalism did not say you cannot critique capitalism while being part of it
Not the guy you were replying to, but there's a difference between "being a part of it" and explicitly partaking in its worst excesses. In capitalism you might need a smartphone, but you don't need an iphone.
Also, psychoanalytics is a bunch of bollocks.
>>
No. 69132
>>69128
>Because said critic of capitalism did not say you cannot critique capitalism while being part of it
With an adidas pullover and an I-phone, you make a point out of being part of it, ostentatiously, you want everyone to know. If you do not think consumerism maxed up to 100% is great, then maybe do not sport its symbols as visibly as possible.
>>
No. 69133 Kontra
>>69129
That analysis seems about right.
>>
No. 69135 Kontra
>>69131
One is integrated in a system, hence a part. What part, would be another discussion that would have to be led ofc.

Also, psychoanalysis was important for its time as it was arguing for unconscious processes and against a fully conscious (all-controlling) subject/ivity ideal, an enlightenment era heir.

>>69132
Hitting on contradictions is an essential experience for critique of capitalism, not sure if you know that. Knowing what is bad though doesn't magically make you free/get rid of it.
>>
No. 69136 Kontra
>>69135
>Hitting on contradictions is an essential experience for critique of capitalism, not sure if you know that. Knowing what is bad though doesn't magically make you free/get rid of it.
Adidas pullovers do not magically materialize in your closet. I phones are not beamed into your hand. These are not things where you do not have agency. This man bought this pullover, this man bought this phone. This pullover and this phone are as consumerist as it gets. He might a conscious decision in favor of these two symbols.

If he thinks consumerism has overwhelmingly negative effects, he should not have bought these things. If he thinks consumerism is just the thing, he shouldn't formulate a critique of it just to score points in a discussion. Either way, he comes of as a clown.

He did not "hit on a contradiction", he created it.
>>
No. 69138 Kontra
>>69136
You overread something in my initial part on Adorno (him being fond of psychoanalysis) hence your argument is rather pointless from Adornos perspective and thus the guy can easily quote him without getting in trouble, because trapped in consumerism from birth on this guy has fallen for consumerism to a certain extent and he can be aware of it, and yet feel hard to leave it, because the overall system and ideological stance put pressure on the individual (which is not an individual to Adorno anymore but part of a mass, though at the same time the individual is the solution to overcome capitalism and break free from the mass and its effects, it is a paradox, hence negative dialectics is crucial, as Adorno articulates the thought/thinking of that paradox in that one).

>He did not "hit on a contradiction", he created it.

creating something and recognizing something is not the same.

>he shouldn't formulate a critique of it just to score points

What points? You can critique consumerism and still partake in it to a certain extent, people drink alcohol even though they know its bad for them, but according to you sheer willpower moves everything, I'm not sure if your idealism makes a good materialist :^) Surely, there is a chance of being aware and then changing things, but a certain resistance to will is there. Probably a resistance that is not available to conscious control to circle back to the beginning of my post.
>>
No. 69139
295 kB, 800 × 1224
>>
No. 69140
>>69138
This is your default explanation for everything you consider wrong with the world. Simple.

>but according to you sheer willpower moves everything
The opposite is true: no willpower moves nothing.

>partake to a certain extent
Yeah, I only partake to a certain extent with this coca-cola tattoo on my forehead and this apple I-Probe in my ass, it's all subconscious, you know.
Sorry for the sarcasm, but this point of view is so damn self-righteous and comfortable. You do not have to change your behavior one iota and can shift all of the blame elsewhere, into the diffuse totality of 'the system'. (in quotation marks.)
>>
No. 69141
I'd formulate it differently.

it's not that one is "morally obliged" to abstain from certain things if they have certain convictions, or believe that the abstinence would affect anything or create any significant change, or that certain behavior or lack thereof "qualifies" someone to be a X in a "no true scotsman" way.

but I think that somebody who is actually 100% serious about his ideological convictions wouldn't have interest or desire in such things in the first place.

It's like a FOSS and privacy activist who uses Windows and has a facebook account. Yeah, doing these things doesn't invalidate your views, but, uh, you'd think a staunch belief in these things would necessitate not doing certain things.
>>
No. 69145
>>69140
>This is your default explanation for everything you consider wrong with the world. Simple.

Refer to something I said, otherwise it is not clear what you mean with explanation of the world, because I did not explain the world, I explained why he can quote/refer Adorno, because Adorno wouldn't be surprised or angry if he had an Iphone while doing so.

>The opposite is true: no willpower moves nothing.

ok, and what do you want to tell me? I never just denied will.

>You do not have to change your behavior one iota and can shift all of the blame elsewhere, into the diffuse totality of 'the system'. (in quotation marks.)

I was wondering if you are the same German that was going crazy over grain, gender and German weakness and this is pretty much just blaming the system ánd not doing anything else.
And I don't the an absolute problem in blaming a system,a system is an abstraction but it is a useful explanation and works with circular causality, maybe that is your problem. Something being abstract is not automatically a problem, or you you hate models and mathematics as well? Science in general works with abstractions, stating relations is usually nothing but an abstraction, you cannot "see" relations and yet every system is based on the premise of relations.

>this coca-cola tattoo on my forehead and this apple I-Probe in my ass, it's all subconscious,

Besides making a hyperbole out of it where it is not necessary... you were born into a consumer society and can be become aware of it or not, being trained from both it is not easy to abandon it. And I don't even consume much brand products, sure I like some nice shoes but they don't have to be Adidas every time, but despite having a brand tag, a shoe has an aesthetic quality and I don't think its wrong to consider aesthetics, its pretty much normal.
But why do you deny unconscious processes? Are you in control of everything you do or do you need a little fantasy to stabilize yourself? Advertisement is not a big fat budget concern by accident, just saying.

And you shift the blame on individuals, why not blame the owners of the means of production that organize this process? Adidas and Apple should just stop producing these phones if it is bad.
>>
No. 69146 Kontra
>>69145
>And you shift the blame on individuals, why not blame the owners of the means of production that organize this process?
Because the owners of the means of production will never be interested in giving up these means of production peacefully. You can't blame them for being rationally selfish.
But you can blame the working class for doing absolutely nothing besides spreading their ass-cheeks and willingly getting chipped or marked with QR-codes like cattle or slave-caste because they are fearful and thus easily conform to the "new normal". This is irrational behavior.
>>
No. 69147
>>69146
>>69145
People are social animals, therefore irrational. If they were not, in a perfect free market, advertisements would not work and not exist, as they only make a product more expensive and offer no value. It's the main problem of classic liberalism that it starts with a wrong image of human nature.

Blame games are also neither rational nor productive.
>>
No. 69151
Vegains abstain from an entire food group, but first world leftists apparently can't abstain from luxury goods because they're "animals" or whatever lmao
>>
No. 69152 Kontra
10 kB, 404 × 325
>>69151
vegans might be the only ones who survive what's coming
>>
No. 69153 Kontra
>>69151
I don't think that smartphones (that includes older iPhones) and sneakers are luxury goods. Also, in the first world, vegains might have an Iphone, how did that blows your brains out, central asian man? First worlders can only be abstinent and refuse to partake in a certain amount of things before they lose their first worlder status, it is what it is, I don't make the rules.
>>
No. 69154
>>69153
>vegains might have an Iphone
They don't claim to be anticapitalists, so it's fine for them to have an iphone.
>lose their first worlder status
But isn't that the whole point of leftism lmao
>>
No. 69155 Kontra
>>69154
The triad of being vegan, having an iphone and being anticapitalist is not uncommon. I'm sure the schizo German will hold a hate speech about this truism(!) soon.
>>
No. 69156
>>69155
So you're saying first worlders care more about farm animals than the poor oppressed third world working class?
Very evil.

I bet farm animals have better living conditions than most third worlders lmao
Lol!
>>
No. 69157
Can't you people just get along and discuss this war in peace without belligerently deviating?
>>
No. 69158 Kontra
368 kB, 1280 × 1280
International help helpers.
>>
No. 69159
>>69158
People from all over the world pour into ukraine for a chance to kill russians.
They should start charging for tickets, I'm afraid the demand might be too high.
>>
No. 69161 Kontra
6,0 MB, 1280 × 720, 0:38
>>69159
I'm gonna get some Russians delivered straight to my doorstep as they declared the sanctions to be an act of war.
>>
No. 69163
Oh, silly Germans. You were so naive to choose vegan food and wind turbines over metallurgy and coal mining. You fooled yourselves with social studies and frivolous pop culture.
Now we'll come to you, conquer your "country" and you'll bow before us. We'll impregnate your women, fill their wombs with strong Russian seed. They will be happy and grateful because they prefer true men over German soyboys. They'll beg us to pass our superiors genes to their offspring. After it we'll switch to German feminine "males" who will moan "Oh dast ist fantastish!" while we penetrate their shaved butts and make them our sissy bitches.
Germany will become our colony. They will be superseded because of their race descent and quit the stage of history. This is the fate you chose, Germans.
>>
No. 69169 Kontra
313 kB, 1280 × 720, 0:03
>>69163
Sanctions hitting hard?

>So, it is world war then.
-President of Finland
>>
No. 69170 Kontra
>>69156
It is not uncommon for farm animals to have their own room and two weeks of vacation every year :DDD Germany is so weak they give all to their farming animals and are themselves empty-handed and without any possessions.

>>69163
Just found out the 100 billion for the Bundeswehr will be used for yoga classes, vertical soy farming, toxic masculinity seminars, razor blades and high-tech anal dildos (Maulwurf IIIst model will be replaced with a new model by H&K in a jointventure with Rheinmetall called Rohrrammer)
>>
No. 69171
179 kB, 1080 × 805
And so, Putlerjugend was born. I wonder what sort of a antics they will adopt. Even though a roman salute would fit their attire well, it doesn't really go together with the whole "denazification" theme. Remains to be seen.

>>69170
Fuck I hate the FDF. Germans got their military issued high tech dildos while we had to make our own out of wood. God what a shithole.
>>
No. 69172
181 kB, 1440 × 720
>According to information received from the headquarters of the Red Army, our troops posted on the Carelian Isthmus, in the vicinity of the village of Mainila, were the object to-day, November 26th, at 3.45 p.m., of unexpected artillery fire from Finnish territory. In all, seven cannon-shots were fired, killing three privates and one non-commissioned officer and wounding seven privates and two men belonging to the military command. The Soviet troops, who had strict orders not to allow themselves to be provoked, did not retaliate.

>In bringing the foregoing to your knowledge, the Soviet Government consider it desirable to stress the fact that, during the recent negotiations with M. Tanner and M. Paasikivi, they had directed their attention to the danger resulting from the concentration of large regular forces in the immediate proximity of the frontier near Leningrad. In consequence of the provocative firing on Soviet troops from Finnish territory, the Soviet Government are obliged to declare now that the concentration of Finnish troops in the vicinity of Leningrad, not only constitutes a menace to Leningrad, but is, in fact, an act hostile to the U.S.S.R. which has already resulted in aggression against the Soviet troops and caused casualties.

>The Government of the U.S.S.R. have no intention of exaggerating the importance of this revolting act committed by troops belonging to the Finnish Army – owing perhaps to a lack of proper guidance on the part of their superiors – but they desire that revolting acts of this nature shall not be committed in future.

Truly Putin is not made of steel. Were he a man of resolve, he would have shelled Donetsk and Luhansk himself before ordering a full mobilization to destroy the white guardist Ukrainian Republic. Half-measures will get you nowhere.
>>
No. 69173 Kontra
>>69171
Russia is not a nation.
>>
No. 69174
237 kB, 1600 × 1200
43 kB, 375 × 500
3,9 MB, 848 × 560, 0:28
>>69171
>And so, Putlerjugend was born
It's not the first attempt. There were nashists (pic1 and pic2 are from their camp) and there is "youth army" (webm 3).
>>
No. 69176
131 kB, 1280 × 720
>>69174
And all the attempts are naturally doomed to fail. Modern Russia cannot produce any meaningful nationwide ideology besides money.
>>
No. 69180
126 kB, 960 × 960
>>69176
Coherence is superfluous.
What matters is adhesion to the laws of dialectical developments.
>>
No. 69183
>>69171
Really?
>>
No. 69184 Kontra
195 kB, 750 × 1110
>>69183
Forgot pic
>>
No. 69186
163 kB, 533 × 839
>>68886
Actually, there are many of them.
>>
No. 69187
Explosions over Odessa, might be air attacks.
>>
No. 69188
88 kB, 800 × 447
Pretty good lecture by a retired intelligence officer of FDF. Couple of years old already but now with English subtitles. Personally enjoyed it very much and it's enlightening to someone not deep in Russian history and soul. Somehow re-frames all those special Olympics I used to participate in by arguing with Russians on Kacey. In any case it's a shallow but efficient peek at Russian spirit, history and future. Can't judge if the assessments factual though he does seem to present his case well.

It's like the old meme of planet Earth being diagnosed with incurable disease that is Russia was true after all. I'm especially worried if the recent media bans and internet restrictions will stay in place for any extended period of time. Then there are no brakes on this train.

Not really related to what's happening in Ukraine but I figured if anyone would be at all interested in watching this they'd probably be in this thread. Also my intention wasn't to offend our resident Russians here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kF9KretXqJw

>>69174
Good lord I hope those haven't been too popular.
>>
No. 69189
90 kB, 640 × 410
Let's assume the Wect really valued human life – of some humans more than of others – and wanted to drain, impede and ideally end the current bloodshed more than it wants to prolong an attrition of Russia's military resources. What would be the pros and cons of publicly announcing guaranteed safe entry and asylum to any men (of both warring sides, or less unrealistically just of the evil side) who wish to evade being drafted to the military?
And should such refugees be required to present proof of imminent recruitment or similar, or should all able males be treated as being at risk, which would open the door to an influx of millions of potential refugees?
Shouldn't EU states offer asylum at least to people already in the military, drafted or not? Allowing those people out of the war would be most effective in draining the war of its resources, but I think anybody willing to desert would have a much harder time to reach a third country, so realistically very few would-be deserters would actually benefit from such an offer compared to the greater number of able males who haven't been drafted yet and might actually take the EU up on such an offer.

During the Kosovo War, Hungary rejected a Serb who didn't want to go to war. If I recall correctly, Hungary deported him to Serbia or turned him away at the border and (IIRC) this was judged legal. So I would be surprised if the West acted any less hypocritically now, but we can dream, no?
>>
No. 69191 Kontra
>>69189
No thank you, we don't dream about men. But you can go ahead and dream about it.
>>
No. 69192
>>69189
So did you put any more thought into that suggestion than "It's giving me a warm fuzzy feeling"?
Do you even know how many people live in Russia and how many of them can be drafted? And women can be fed to cannons, too, you know? Or is that your plan, make them just draft EVERYONE, so they MUST rebel?
Also, will YOU pay for them? Will YOU compete with them for jobs? Will YOU share your flat with them? Or anything else, for that matter?
>>
No. 69193
1,6 MB, 424 × 240, 0:41
>>69189
Men eligible for military service should never be allowed as refugees anywhere, with maybe some exceptions if there's a genocide taking place and they are completely unable to defend themselves.

In any case if you would require proof for them getting drafted they couldn't cross the border on their side. So you would only get a tiny amount of refugees who manage to cross the border by themselves through illegal crossings. At that point allowing refugees is just a psyop and not a concrete humanitarian effort.
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No. 69194
>>69193
>Men [...] should never be allowed [...] anywhere
FTFY, happy 8th of March!
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No. 69195
>>69192
>So did you put any more thought into that
I haven't put any thought into it, that's where you come in. I was just wondering why "politisch verfolgt" apparently applies to all kinds of things but I've never seen it applied to this.
>Do you even know how many people live in Russia and how many of them can be drafted?
Have you read the part where I wrote
>which would open the door to an influx of millions of potential refugees

>so they MUST rebel
Nobody's going to rebel and if they did, it wouldn't succeed. See Kazakhstan. Instead, my half-baked idea was more like "less soldiers, less bloodshed".

>will YOU pay for them?
The alternative that we've got now is that you will be paying for increased military spending, what's so much better about that? I understand that we will never be able to deport them back as long as they face a risk of trial for desertion / draft evasion, long after the war is over and it has lost its purpose. I assume it wouldn't be possible to restrict the offer to the duration of hostilities and after that try to evict people (like Germany deported Afghan refugees to pacified Afghanistan in 2021), would it?
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No. 69196
136 kB, 770 × 960
>>69194
Oh yeah good fix! Happy March 8th as well.
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No. 69197
>>69193
>if you would require proof
>allowing refugees is just a psyop and not a concrete humanitarian effort

Yes, that's why I was wondering about doing away with the requirements. The offering state(s) would, as far as its laws allow, adjust requirements depending on whether it's supposed to be a mere PR gesture or to actually drain the war.
So depending on the rules, it might only benefit a few lucky ones who happen to already be on Western soil.

>with maybe some exceptions if there's a genocide taking place
Isn't that what both parties to the current bloodshed are (predictably) accusing each other of? So, a German court (for example) would have to judge whether such exceptions apply in this case. Perhaps it would come down to each individual's circumstances, bogging down courts for years to come.
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No. 69198 Kontra
I've came to the conclusion that i am indeed a Jew. In this conflict i just can't pick any other side besides my own side.
I just can't, it's too reasonable and convinient to stay neutral and outside of this political bullshit and to be just an observer.
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No. 69199
484 kB, 2000 × 1333
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCiJV-UJJ6c
Actually while you guys may be indiscriminately punishing the average Russian in cluster bombing their civilians economically, you actually did just fuck me too. As if anti-maskers and other such idiots prolonging our pandemic wasn't bad enough, this just pushed me real fuckin deep into the red in our stock market by I think something like 15% overall and I'm already planning on losing much much more in the freefall while hoping I can just buy the dip. Key note: the "dip" is probably going to last me fucking years now. So, great going too Putler.

By the way, while I think Russia was being unspeakably retarded on the surface about climate change, what he actually did say was the very first time anyone has ever given me even an explanation why "da globohomos" would want to "hoax" it, which is much funnier when you consider the ameribears reacting to that explanation. But as to why I fucking hate Musk so much at this point as another terrible global elite who, like a certain former POTUS, just had good publicity to ruse people into believing either he is "some cool guy who smoked weed with Joe Rogan" or controlled opposition candidate, all while discretely being just another owner of Goldman Sachs tier CEO.

I bring this up just because it's obvious to me the sole and only reason for Musk's bullshit cars is because it's explicitly designed to take away both our own agency and privacy from our own vehicles, as well as to take ourselves off the teet not only just of OPEC, but to explicitly make us less reliant upon that gas station masquerading as a country.
And that is literally the only reason for Tesla. It's just to make out automative industry not reliant on them. It has fuckall to do with the environment and climate, which is a real thing, much like the elites use any excuse for their agendas. See this is the thing I think people fail to realize the most, is that their logic of conspiracy is "surely this whole pandemic was engineered because eich elites got richer." No it wasn't. It was a black swan event. It's like saying gee, how mysterious it is that the very people who designed the system to benefit the rich elites like themselves, and who usually find any event or excuse to routinely benefit and enrich themselves, somehow benefited and enriched themselves.

Just like they are also going to find literally any event which fucks the middle and lower classes, as it has always been the case of shitty hierachical and non-meritocratic societies since the days of Greece and Rome and Egypt, they are somehow going to find a way to make gobs of money off this war, which is just like they always do. Just like every other day, I can rest easy being assured people like Putin will continue to steal and he'll go to bed tonight in even more luxurious wealth as the average Russian starved, and I will lose lots of money all ultimately winding up in the same pockets of all the same people you and I both work for because don't kid yourselves your boss is my boss. It doesn't matter who you are reading this. Your boss is still my boss ultimately at the end of the day. The question is who do we serve. I understand why the various groups and ideologies came to their conclusions, but the problem is they kept doing it without doing away all their human leadership, and instead replacing one psychopathic murdering thief with another.
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No. 69200
>>69188
Not gonna watch 2h long video, but here is a thread about Russia:
https://nitter.net/kamilkazani/status/1500495309595725831
When you learn all these facts, it's easy to become "rusophobe". It's even easier when you live at Russia and don't have to learn anything because you meet these people IRL.

The question on how much Russian people support war is complicated because there is no reliable sociology. All supposedly independent organizations like "Levada" are allowed to exist and you should always ask yourself, why Kremlin hasn't imprisoned them yet. Are they below radar? Or are they controlled? Or maybe you just have to wait a bit more, to seem them end up in prison? Another thing is that any survey is faulty because people in such country don't want to disclose that they disagree with authorities, so they don't answer honestly.

The guy from twitter mentions many civil cars with Z-letters. But I've seen none. Meanwhile seen two anti-war graffities (15 minutes of walk from each other) and my neighbor hanged anti-governments posters to commieblock hall. But that's a big city, and maybe in small towns situation is different. But even there there is an issue with "putings". You maybe heard about Russian meetings, where people go to protest, get beaten by police and get fined. But also there are "putings", loyalist meetings to where on the opposite people are forced to go by their employers (if they work in government sector). And such events are attended by even fewer people!

So you can say that putinism is historical happenstance, and should Yeltsin choose another successor, none of these would happen. It's just few people who control oil rent, police, FSB and propaganda machine and therefore hold whole country by balls. Get rid of the clique at top, and everything else will change too.
Or you may say that putinism is result of grassroot demand for bootlicking, in other words unavoidable consequence of history, culture and "mysterious Russian soul". So the only way to change the country is to divide it into 15 states under protectorate of West and China, forbid Dostoevsky as extremist literature and make population forget Russian language.

I rather believe in first model of reality but not sure.
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No. 69201
>>69200

I suspect a part of these campaigns is not only to create an illusion of support, but also to demonize the russian people in the eyes of outsiders, so that russians feel surrounded by enemies.
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No. 69202
83 kB, 1006 × 830
>>69200
>Not gonna watch 2h long video
But it's only 1 hour long. I just linked it here in case anyone is curious enough. Probably doesn't have much of interest for a Russian citizen.

Your link didn't really surprise me. Russia has a large population and many people actually support Putin. And for sure there's a bunch of that support being manufactured by the propagandists. Like you said it's difficult to gauge what the actual support is, especially for the war.

The situation might improve if you got rid of all the corrupt shits at the top though I don't think it's going to happen any time soon. On the video the guy mention's the concept of Homo Sovieticus which still appears to be alive or making a comeback. Don't know if it's a real thing and one you are aware of.

It's hard to see a future where Russia is any less fucked so if I were in your shoes I'd try to move elsewhere. Easy to say, I know.
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No. 69203
>>69153
They are luxury goods.

Look I don't want to wade into this whole field of shit splaying out before me but suffice to say that your guys' biggest problem here is in their hypocrisy which at the same time exposes your own channer apathy. Like even if they are iphone hipster twats all around at least they're not doing something which makes a positive impact on the world or betters themselves. That which I disdain the most about whole chans themselves at this point it isn't even an ocean of piss, but an ocean of pus. Chans are nurgles pus, the most congealed form of crab bucket mentality. So far as I've ever seen one of the worst most stereotypical chantards is a kind of northpole browsing incel who's got no hobbies, no friends, no remarkable interests to speak of, yet somehow feels like his unemployed ass is God's gift to women like he just deserves the world to change for him, but without doing a single damn thing about himself. And the thing about that is, the pus ocean is just swimming with people that despise anybody who puts just the remotest of efforts into bettering himself, be it getting a hobby, working out, going on a first date, thinking about school again, whatever.

This is because it forces him to leave his mental comfort zone, which makes him feel smaller, inferior, weak, and rather than actually do a thing about that, he instead wishes just to tear others down back to his level. It is like if Russia became a personality trait. It is because of that which is why ultimately lots of channers don't even care about the hypocritical parts, they are all hypocrites themselves, but rather the actual betterment part. Like guy runs a youtube channel? Fuck that guy, he makes me feel less important. Someone has a job? Lol fucking normie. All it is is one great big massive cope about being not just failures in life, but the sort of special case failures who refuse to change themselves and demand no one else become better either. It's like the pathos of those people who have shitbook accounts just to go and see these competitions of carefully curated "look what a life I am!" galleries, only to feel bad about themselves.

So who the fuck cares? Actually learn how to make friends if it bothers you. Somebody points out the hypocrisy or contradictions inherent to globalist neoliberalism i.e. Capitalism and abstains from a part of it, while gorging on other aspects? So then become better than that guy ffs, and don't just do it by sitting on your filth encrusted asses, but actually actively work on becoming better than that guy, not even to show off, but just to become better for yourself. I suspect this last part is even the most foreign to them, because it's all about "flexing" and thus solely done as a social galleria, as opposed to actively doing it for yourself because they don't actually care about their own lives.

So stop fucking engaging in it then. Go and do something which actually has an impact in the way things are done. If you're all so smart then go and write a book on it and why you think this can be done better. Hell you all certainly shitpost enough for it. Don't feel smart enough to do that? Then go and actually teach yourself more about that topic by reading actual books and not just shitposting. I mean Jesus Christ you're all seriously still arguing about that in Ukraine thread
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No. 69204
The situation with spoiled rations and lack of fuel once again confirms Verbitsky's words:
> "The fight against corruption" in Rushka is pure sabotage, because the laws that the Duma shit has adopted are incompatible with any reasonable life, and it is impossible not to violate them. That is, corruption is actually the last breath of air. And Navalny wants to deprive us of this? Demagogy, and moronic one.
> Corruption opposes the Kremlin's cannibals and sabotages any Kremlin-cannibal initiative. Corruption is the last thing that makes life in Rushka bearable. Rushka is half gulag, a giant torture machine, and half corruption. To fight corruption means to achieve the transformation of Rushka into a total gulag.
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No. 69205
>>69154
It isn't. It's the strawman conceptualization of 1st world progressives. Often unwittingly encouraged by those nitwits themselves, often because of not understanding the truism "...but then, everything else also is shit." Which arguably is no more retarded ultimately than romanticizing murderous and long dead defeated ideologies because "but muh strength muh fashies." God. I always hated that would. I could just imagine the spoiled, 14 year old suburbanite hands that wrote it every time.

By the way, brick, you somehow act as though all these people live in mcmansions. They don't. They're missing their teeth, have no health coverage or have multithousand dollar deductibles, are heavily in debt, and basically anything they even have which is first world they came across only incidentally by being somewhere in proximity to it. It's quite funny that you say all this edgy shit while yourself not even realizing at all that all those first world images are itself a spook, an artifact of a massive propaganda campaign convincing you all anyone ever knows is red cups and apeple pies in mini-mansions. One would think you'd at least have absorbed something from those meme videos at this point about the way many Westerners actually live, which is literally Ryssian tier abject poverty.

Go watch some yutube videos not on it, but actual interviews with people living the life. The way many white Americans live here especially in the poorest rural areas literally looks like Russia. That purchasing parity doesn't mean much when your particle board shack is collapsing and even that you can't afford. America has just been much more savvy about how it uses the mass media to propagandize a very specific image in foreign minds of what it entails. Still better than living under Russian management obviously but still.

>>69157
This. Hopefully this thrad itself will soon be kill, and then at last struggle is over and we can remake #3 in a better image. You always fuck up the first two flapjacks.

>>69159
Thing is, average Russian suffers too. Well yes the vata deserve to suffer and I for one look forward to these faces of these bydlo upon discovering their based chessmaster led them straight to 90s, but some good portion of Russians suffer under same shit. The ones saying how Ukraine deserved this and it makes us stronker etc. absolutely deserve every inch of this sanctioned economy destroying dick up their asses, but we see the good Russians on here who are not deranged, and clearly based on protests you go to many years Russian jail there are many who are not only sane but also show bravery. So no sense cheering on their despair. The rest can walk into Finnish landmines though if they're stupid enough to go full bydlo liberator.

I suspect actually understanding Russian TB right now would be brain damaging. Certainly what I seen was.
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No. 69206
>>69202
I wouldn't mock the wooden armour. It's actually pretty effective at what it does, which is add a disposable frontal surface to eat shaped charges. It looks silly, but it's the same principle as the fences that are put in western vehicles.

Also RE: refugees

It actually costs us more money to keep refugees locked up on the border than if they did the 'unthinkable' and were on our unemployment benefits. So tbh, yeah I would actually be okay with my taxes going there instead of offshore concentration camps.

Also, if I had my own place, I'd be okay with boarding someone until they could find their own place. I've lived with a heroin addict, and immigrants before. It's honestly just a spook for booj morality. Half the time I got more in common with the foreign lads than I do the white collar locals.
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No. 69207
>>69206
That would be true if the vehicle itself had any armor. Those were strapped to an unarmored logistics truck so anything that would disable the vehicle in the first place will do so even with the logs. Shaped charges included. And if you’ve ever shot a small log like that with a rifle you probably know it goes through with no issue. Plenty of military uses for logs but that’s just funny. Russian version of Mad Max.
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No. 69208
>>69207
The point isn't to be totally secure. Even the wrap fencing isn't designed to stop anything but small shoulder mounted ones (with some luck). It's not meant to be perfect protection, but it could give you a chance to bail as opposed to zero chance, while not degrading performance too much. Those small chances mean something in an era of 'who is seen first typically dies'. From an armchair perspective it might seem silly, but if you're driving the truck do you take the 99% chance of getting killed if you're hit by something or the 100%?

I mean, the Taliban did a lot more with a lot less. They put the fear of God into modern militaries with fertiliser and cellphones. Don't judge something by optics alone.
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No. 69209
3,9 MB, 640 × 480, 0:48
3,9 MB, 480 × 360, 1:16
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Found a bunch of stuff from Ukraine 2014 in my /k/ folder, figured I'd drop it here

Sad stuff bros
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No. 69213 Kontra
>>69200
>the only way to change the country is to divide it into 15 states under protectorate of West and China, forbid Dostoevsky as extremist literature and make population forget Russian language.
So basically instead of forming your own opinion on the situation - you have adopted Zbigniew Brzezinski's rhetoric and became a neoliberal nutcase obsessed with destroying the country you live in over the idea of the globalist world order? How are you different from communists or catholic zealots or nationalists?
Your solution to the problem of yourself being a massive failure as a human being is to basically turn into an insane incel.
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No. 69214
>>69195
>I haven't put any thought into it, that's where you come in. I was just wondering why "politisch verfolgt" apparently applies to all kinds of things but I've never seen it applied to this.
The thing is, just being "politisch verfolgt" is not an indicator that this person is in any way desirable to have in any country. Provided non-islamists would win, an ISIS leader would also be "politisch verfolgt". If we ban all rightwing parties, everyone of them would be "politisch verfolgt", too, so it's imo a bad indicator for anything. Also, as the finn said, how can you prove it? There are just too many "if"s and "when"s here.

>Have you read the part where I wrote
>which would open the door to an influx of millions of potential refugees
Ernst, again, do you even know just how many people live in Russia? We are not talking about "only" two or three millions refugees in your scenario, we are talking about an amount of refugees that would lead to strong russian minorities, if not even legit majorities in the countries that would take them. Or was that your plan? Swarm the west with russians and take over like that? I mean, it would indeed prevent bloodshed if they could just vote to belong to USSR.

>Nobody's going to rebel and if they did, it wouldn't succeed. See Kazakhstan. Instead, my half-baked idea was more like "less soldiers, less bloodshed".
>"less soldiers, less bloodshed".
Yeah, that could probably apply in a time before artillery, rockets and weapons of mass destruction.

>The alternative that we've got now is that you will be paying for increased military spending, what's so much better about that? I understand that we will never be able to deport them back as long as they face a risk of trial for desertion / draft evasion, long after the war is over and it has lost its purpose. I assume it wouldn't be possible to restrict the offer to the duration of hostilities and after that try to evict people (like Germany deported Afghan refugees to pacified Afghanistan in 2021), would it?
That's not what I was asking. Also, you are operating under the premise that this is a one-time unique aggression. I think the finn is justified in shitting his pants, because he knows they are next. Something even the most hardcore leftists are now starting to understand is that you can't live in peace if you don't have the means of defending that peace. Just being peaceful and nothing else means being a pushover. I also don't like that they are spending SO MUCH before even tackling the corruption problem and bad political leadership, but maybe this time they will at least try not to do the bare minimum to get elected again (which is what happens in all the other fields that are in dire need of money), but instead now have the whole world looking at them and watching their steps. I wonder what kind of crisis would have to happen to cause a similar movement for stuff like education and healthcare.
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No. 69216 Kontra
>>69200
I am not a regular poster here, I browse the site once in a while in the read-only mode as the krautchan legacy, but it hurts me to see when people, on a serious note, compare russians to fascism based on a couple of premises concerning people supporting their army. It's as if the entire thinking tradition has degraded so strongly it has to be employed in diving people into we/them.
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No. 69217
>>69209
filmed by BBC? The news media that brainwashed the Brits into thinking that taking as mush cheap labor from Africa as possible is good for them. The same news media that tell the British that Brexit isn't really possible and a bad idea?
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No. 69218
>>69213
As for me, I see no solution at the moment here, only pray, do what you must and come what may.

The future is bleak, scenarios with an ultra-right military junta (all the preconditions are in place) and/or another Communist civil war seem predominant.

I'd dream about some left-wing rationalist Christian ideology taking root and spreading (effectively disarming both fascists and communists), but, frankly, it's unlikely to happen.
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No. 69220
68 kB, 640 × 474
Gas prices breaking the 2€/L ceiling. Pretty wild. Didn't think I'd see this. Generally, the national mood is very pro-Ukraine with the communist party standing as the sole anti-NATO bastion. Police now have to give them protection at rallies and so on, lest they'd get their skulls caved in by counter-protestors. hmm, the agents of the bourgeoisie (police) defending the proletarian vanguard))
Even more surreal is everyone discussing these happenings while a significant amount of people pre-invasion wasn't sure what a Ukraine was. Everyone has an opinion and it seems that my slavologist credentials mean nothing anymore.
Still impressed at how well the Ukrainians are holding up, heroic people.

>>69205
I should have known those claims that you'd leave of your own will in just the next day were lies.
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No. 69222
>>69218
Christian Ideology was one of the reasons of tension, at least, separation of Ukrainian orthodox church.

Actually, tech specialists here not supporting war so much.

> scenarios with an ultra-right military junta (all the preconditions are in place) and/or another Communist civil war seem predominant.

You will be fucked by Rosguard straight after you are exit your flat. You now, bruh, they are considered as truly beasts here.

marxist
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No. 69223 Kontra
403 kB, 900 × 620
Considering the incoming energy crisis i believe that Poland is next.
If i learned anything about Germany is that german people take their quality of life very seriously and right now polish government is doing everything to ruin the stability of the europe out of spite or hatred, i don't know what's wrong with them, but they have completely gone mad and are repeating mistakes of the 1930s.
On top of that Germany was one of the top donors and Poland was one of the top beneficiaries in the past few decades, i think it makes sense Germany would want to have their money back in some form, for example being able to influence politics in Poland which Germany right now has no control of obviously.
Of course Poland will not agree to such terms because they want to be a major power in Europe themselves.
What happens after is to be seen.
I just thank comrade Stalin that he managed to get nukes, otherwise we would've been seriously involved in the upcoming shitstorm.
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No. 69224
>>69222
>>Christian Ideology was one of the reasons of tension, at least, separation of Ukrainian orthodox church.
Christian ideology... where?
Ukraine is, indeed, somewhat more religious than Russia (especially in the West), but the so-called Orthodox Church of Ukraine was basically a private project of Poroshenko supported by nationalist-minded Ukrainian masses and pro-American Bartholomew I (separation in East Europe is always good for the US - divide et empera). There is no actual Christian "ideology" behind that; in fact, it violates the canonical norms and the spirit of the Orthodox Church (the most fervent Orthodox Christians in Ukraine, including the absolute majority of the monks, naturally remain in the UOC, despite strong political pressure and even numerous acts of violence).
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No. 69226
A regional newspaper quoted voices of the Bauernverband (farmer association sort of) that wheat for flour and such is no problem, but wheat/corn for farming animals is and thus this will affect meat prices. Also, while Russia is a large wheat exporter, most pesticides/herbicides come from the west and will not be delivered anymore. I wonder if Russia will just produce their on toxins now, thanks to the collective memory I imagine it to be a deadly 1980s mixture that is very unhealthy for people that consume the wheat.
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No. 69228
210 kB, 1360 × 765
4,0 MB, 640 × 360, 0:47
>Ukraine’s President Volodymyr Zelenskiy expressed willingness to discuss Russia’s demands for Kyiv to recognize annexed Crimea and the breakaway pro-Moscow territories in an interview with ABC News published Tuesday.
Combined with his statements on the impossibility of NATO committing itself to Ukrainian defense, seems like there could be a basis for a ceasefire agreement if the Russians were serious about their demands))
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No. 69229 Kontra
18 kB, 237 × 199
>>69208
>From an armchair perspective it might seem silly, but if you're driving the truck do you take the 99% chance of getting killed if you're hit by something or the 100%
This is very much an armchair general take. Adding logs to your truck isn't just +1 armor but it comes with real downsides and risks not included in your assessment.

Sure, by statistical evaluation you could probably prove that added logs saved 1 out of N trucks from being destroyed when being hit. However, are you sure none crashed because of reduced visibility and mobility? Are you sure all the logs are mounted so that they never fall off in front of the truck while it's going down the highway at 80 km/h? Are you sure they don't fall off when getting struck by rifle rounds or anything else? You're far more likely to kill yourself or break your vehicle with a contraption like that than anything else.
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No. 69230
Speaking of rising gas prices, maybe algal biodiesel now gains some traction. There are some algal strains that have an incredibly high oil content.
Of course, in Germany having large open pond bioreactors wouldn't be that feasible, but if we invest a bit more in modern reactor technology, it could help alleviate a bit the dependence on foreign oil at least for heating/diesel.
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No. 69231
>>69226
>wheat for flour and such is no problem
For Germany. The UN World Food Program is afraid the war will worsen the situation even further, not only in Ukraine but also for instance in Afghanistan or Yemen. Ukraine with its fertile soil is a very important country concerning global agricultural distribution and together with Russia is exporting roughly 30% of global wheat annually. Now with gas prices up and harvests being affected by the war this might add up to a catastrophe. The status of Ukraine as an agricultural power has played a role in this conflict as well before the war started: https://www.zeit.de/wirtschaft/2015-03/ukraine-landwirtschaft-schwarzerde-monsanto
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No. 69234
>>69231
Yes, I was only refering to Germany, the guy actually said west will probably buy away from poor countries' plates. I multiple times posted here that Africa is buying from Ukraine in Ethiopia prices are already rising steeply. This will perhaps mean hunger and flight, which means more refugees overall, and these won't be welcomed as the Ukranians right now.
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No. 69235
>>69228
Let's all just hope it ends as soon as possible. None of us needs Ukraine in blood and ruins, and we need WW3 neither.
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No. 69237
>>69224
Ok, when you're saying this, you're joining this conflict, and I'm far above this schism.

Catholic and pastafarian church are against any armed assaults on Donbass (both sides), and this war, atheists should decide by themselves, what to do.

Orthodox people from both sides going to the "holy war", including many criminals, that are connetted somehow to popes.
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No. 69238
64 kB, 1920 × 806
>>69235
>Let's all just hope it ends as soon as possible
Ideally, this pointless and self-destructive war would have never been started. Still, dragging on the conflict longer than an immediate complete capitulation may prove beneficial and worthy for Ukrainians. If anything, it seems to have possibly already saved them from Yanukovich being restored and Berkut being redeployed. I think Crimea and the people's republics are a deal good enough that Russians could cut their losses and claim victory. After all, the supposed genocide of coal basin Russophones would end.
The end of invasion is, as it always was, in the Kremlin's hands. I worry that given their position on diplomatic corridors to Russia and Belarus, they wont accept this sensible offer for peace. Maybe the demanded constitutional change is the real red line which Kyiv wont cross, which would be reasonable.
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No. 69239
>>69238
Complete capitulation is out of the question as of now. There will be negotiations.
Putin surely miscalculated when he started all of it. And dwellers of Russia and Ukraine have already paid for that mistake heavily.
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No. 69241
121 kB, 1500 × 1200
>>69224
> so-called Orthodox Church of Ukraine was basically a private project of Poroshenko
Don't know if it's true, but so-called "Orthodox Church Of Russia" is a project of 5-th department of KGB. Is organization of commie snitches really preferable for fervent Christians? How do they see patriarch in "Agent Mihailov", living in opulence?
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No. 69242
48 kB, 750 × 744
Nice to see that international Ernst is active. I didn't know that at all.
A certain German picture board has apparently been taken over by lunatics. If counter-opinions are not immediately banned and/or deleted, it is at the very least unironically insinuated that they are paid authors (presumably paid by the Amad**-Anto***-S.), who allegedly populate a small image board 24/7 instead of comment columns of newspapers with thousand times more readers. Sad!
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No. 69244
130 kB, 1141 × 466
>>69242
Don't mess with memes, they might infect and capture your mind. Had not seen this coming 10-12 years ago, the "internet elite" turned out to be weak prey. Would be funny if it wasn't so sad.
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No. 69245
>>69244
Are you implying that cabbagers are the same people who have lurked on old KC?
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No. 69246
>>69241
>>Don't know if it's true, but so-called "Orthodox Church Of Russia" is a project of 5-th department of KGB. Is organization of commie snitches really preferable for fervent Christians?
Look where the monks go and see where fervent Christians are.
Obviously the Church fas forced to cooperate with the KGB to some extent (some didn't and paid for that). And before that it was forced to cooperate with the Tsar. Does it makes the Church untrue? No it doesn't; the Church always teaches that even indecency of a priest doesn't make the sacrament invalid (John the Chrysostom etc.). Splitting God's Church, on the other hand, is a crime against Jesus Christ himself, as any Orthodox knows all too well. And doing that for some stupid nationalistic pride is utter madness. Filaret Denisenko is mad, it isn't very difficult to see looking at him and listening to him. And now Bartholomew I decided to cover that madness under his omophorion, effectively splitting the body of the Church again; he pretends to personally wield the power he doesn't really have according to sacred tradition, the spirit of Orthodox Christianity and common sense. Sapienti sat.
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No. 69248
>>69245
Some certainly, you could tell from the old stuff being posted. I also did, for as long as was bearable.
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No. 69249
>>69246
Aligning itself with whatever political power exists seem very in line with Orthodox Christian tradition.
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No. 69250
4,1 MB, 512 × 640, 0:27
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No. 69253
>>69249
It's an ancient and rather sensible strategy, given that Christianity itself is pretty apolitical. Sometimes, however, the results are rather unpleasant. There's nothing to be proud about the submission to the will of Peter the Great (who practically turned the church into a state institution for two centuries) or the Communist leaders. Nowadays the Russian church strongly depends on the oligarchs as its chief sponsors, but at least it manages to keep its face.
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No. 69256
>>69241
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_anarchism
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Kingdom_of_God_Is_Within_You
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leo_Tolstoy

Just treat the church as a service that provides YOU with churches, funerals and similar things.
It's not necessary to support the Russian Orthodox Church as an entity, what's more important is what you believe in.
I believe in Orthodox Christianity itself. I believe that it's philosophy is better than Roman Catholic which is all about the central "government" and the Pope being basically the emperor.
In the context of international relations this central government is equal to EU , EU parliament and Brusseles all of which promote western european way of life which is not for me personally and i don't wish to be a part of this system.
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No. 69258
3,9 MB, 396 × 720, 0:30
What's going on behind the iron curtain? I was watching some Russian news on youtube a couple of days back but now it's telling me the channels are not available in my country.
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No. 69259
257 kB, 847 × 1024
>>69253
> Christianity itself is pretty apolitical
But communism is very anticlerical which makes collaboration with KGB controversial. Maybe it was worth it. In defense of Russian Orthodox Church I'll say that they still haven't canonized Stalin despite many would like it.
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No. 69261
74 kB, 680 × 425
213 kB, 900 × 600
>>69180
r8
It's "immortal squad" action where people bring portraits of their ancestors who fought against nazis. Poklonskya brought icon of Nicholas II
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No. 69262
>>69259
>>But communism is very anticlerical which makes collaboration with KGB controversial.
As I said, there's nothing to be proud of. But we have survived.
>>69258
>>What's going on behind the iron curtain? I was watching some Russian news on youtube a couple of days back but now it's telling me the channels are not available in my country.
Nothing really new during the last couple of days, apparently. It's holidays anyway, March 8. I never watch TV myself (cannot stand propaganda, and especially Russian state media).
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No. 69263
45 kB, 620 × 349
>>69262
>Nothing really new during the last couple of days, apparently. It's holidays anyway, March 8. I never watch TV myself (cannot stand propaganda, and especially Russian state media).
Alright thanks for the info. I would've just wanted to see what the state media is saying. In my view that doesn't at all align with reality but provides interesting insights still.
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No. 69264
>>69258
Every politician is talking about 8 years of destroying Donetsk and Luhansk.
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No. 69265
>>68858
Seems like a fake.
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No. 69329
>>69264
That seems excessive, I think they will be able to dot it in the next 8 weeks